Lighting Laws in MAss

GVFD82X12

Member
Mar 31, 2011
85
Massachusetts USA
Hello Again.


Sorry for all the "silly" questions. I am still a noob when it comes to lighting.


Anyway. I have asked my FD Chief and some FD Officers, and none know the answer.


I have tried calling the RMV, and looked online to no avail.


Anyway... I am a firefighter/EMT in MA and I have a RED light permit.


My question, is does anyone here know if I can run White up front? And Amber/Red to Rear?


Right now I have a Dual Talon R/R, but I am looking to install a HLF kit that I have.


Just dont know if I will get into trouble using a Head Light Flasher.


Any/all information will be much appriciated.


Thanks guys&gals


Josh
 

DFD382

Member
May 25, 2010
224
SOUTH CAROLINA
GVFD82X12 said:
Hello Again.
Sorry for all the "silly" questions. I am still a noob when it comes to lighting.


Anyway. I have asked my FD Chief and some FD Officers, and none know the answer.


I have tried calling the RMV, and looked online to no avail.


Anyway... I am a firefighter/EMT in MA and I have a RED light permit.


My question, is does anyone here know if I can run White up front? And Amber/Red to Rear?


Right now I have a Dual Talon R/R, but I am looking to install a HLF kit that I have.


Just dont know if I will get into trouble using a Head Light Flasher.


Any/all information will be much appriciated.


Thanks guys&gals


Josh
I live in mass also. I am not sure of the laws for wigwags but I run them. I also have 2 clear LEDS in my liberty in the front. I also have 2 amber in the rear of the bar and have never had a problem. Alot of ppl on my dept run clear as well in the front and amber in the rear..Sorry I couldn't give you the lawful answer but I nor any 1 on my dept has ever had a problem
 

fire1

Member
Jun 5, 2011
621
Michigan
GVFD82X12 said:
Hello Again.
Sorry for all the "silly" questions. I am still a noob when it comes to lighting.


Anyway. I have asked my FD Chief and some FD Officers, and none know the answer.


I have tried calling the RMV, and looked online to no avail.


Anyway... I am a firefighter/EMT in MA and I have a RED light permit.


My question, is does anyone here know if I can run White up front? And Amber/Red to Rear?


Right now I have a Dual Talon R/R, but I am looking to install a HLF kit that I have.


Just dont know if I will get into trouble using a Head Light Flasher.


Any/all information will be much appriciated.


Thanks guys&gals


Josh

Try calling your local state police post. They should be able to help you.
 

Mrlunchbox

Member
Jun 12, 2010
1,293
Central, MA
As far as the HLF goes I guess in a way its up your local PD and Fire Chief. I know in my town some of the guys were using HLF and never ever had an issue. As long as you were using them only when you needed to and weren't abusing them no issue should arise. I remember finding somewhere online in Mass General Laws that wigwags or any type of alternating white light was illegal. However again almost every POV I have seen has some white light to the front. My liberty has the double flashing wigwag as well. I know the laws regarding siren use on a POV are also a no no, however the next paragraph in the law says basically if you do have one you have to notify the RMV. *shrug* So who knows about that as well. In short i'd say if the local cops are cool with you guys I wouldn't worry too much. I haven't had a problem yet.
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
GVFD82X12 said:
Hello Again.
Sorry for all the "silly" questions. I am still a noob when it comes to lighting.


Anyway. I have asked my FD Chief and some FD Officers, and none know the answer.


I have tried calling the RMV, and looked online to no avail.


Anyway... I am a firefighter/EMT in MA and I have a RED light permit.


My question, is does anyone here know if I can run White up front? And Amber/Red to Rear?


Right now I have a Dual Talon R/R, but I am looking to install a HLF kit that I have.


Just dont know if I will get into trouble using a Head Light Flasher.


Any/all information will be much appriciated.


Thanks guys&gals


Josh

I am an authority on this subject... the short answer is that you should* be fine to do what you have stated.


*The long answer is that MGL CH 90 Sec 7e allows for the holder of a Red Light Permit to "mount or display a flashing, rotating or oscillating red light in any direction." There is nothing in this section that allows for the use of any other color in a personal vehicle.


Here is the even longer answer:


Now, in the strict technical sense even amber lights need permits in the Commonwealth... And in there is no provision in the law for the use of a flashing, rotating or oscillating white light.


That said, no one polices amber lights, and white lights are generally included in any decent emergency lighting package. (Even Mass State Police have a forward facing white in their liberty bars.)


Here is what you should take away: What you are allowed to get away with is generally up to your local Police / MSP and Fire Department standards. It is very common in my neck of the woods for people to run R/C Talons, or a red dash light and wigwags. In fact, I'd even go as far as to say that many people feel a setup is incomplete until there is some white thrown in. And as long as you keep it R/A to the rear I can't imagine anyone giving you a hard time. Look around your department and see what is allowed in general. If people run WigWags, you should be fine to run them as well. If people have amber to the rear, you should be able to get away with it to.


Since a lot of these setups are illegal already (in the strict technical sense) just fall in line with what others are doing (and getting away with) and you should be all set.


I will also leave you with this: If I were you I would not even think about putting blue anywhere in your setup. Chapter 90/7e allows for a "fire apparatus" to display a "flashing, rotating or oscillating blue light in the opposite direction in which the vehicle is proceeding." There is no clear definition of what a "fire apparatus" is, but it is thought to mean a vehicle owned/registered to a fire department. You slap a blue light in the back of your POV and I imagine a friendly LEO is going to ask you in short order to take it out. It may be tempting to have one in there... but you are going to have trouble winning that argument.


$0.02
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
I meant to include the link to the Chapter/Section for emergency lighting:


General Laws: CHAPTER 90, Section 7E


To the issue of sirens...


Some departments around me don't allow for their members to run sirens... some encourage it.


The wording can be found in General Laws: CHAPTER 90, Section 16. It reads:

"No siren shall be mounted upon any motor vehicle except fire apparatus, ambulances, vehicles used in official line of duty by any member of the police or fire fighting forces of the commonwealth or any agency or political subdivision thereof, and vehicles owned by call fire fighters or by persons with police powers and operated in official line of duty, unless authorized by the registrar. "


There is no such thing as a "Siren Permit" in the Commonwealth. Technically, if you were responding to a call and didn't have a Red Light Permit you could still use a siren and not be in violation.


However, most LEOs consider the Red Light Permit to also be a make-shift "Siren Permit" as well.


In the end, a Red Light Permit can be revoked at any time by either the Registrar or your Department Chief... both of whom listen to the suggestions of the local Law Enforcement Agency... so it behoves you to play nice in the sandbox, if you catch my drift.
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
And one last thing (I think).


Remember, technically a Red Light Permit is only a "courtesy light" in the Commonwealth. A personal vehicle does not have the same authority that a department vehicle ("Apparatus") has while responding to emergencies.


The use of a red light while responding to an emergency does not grant you the authority to violate any traffic laws, and other vehicles are not required by law to yield the right-of-way to you in your personal vehicle.


If you cross a line to go around a vehicle it's still a "marked lanes" violation. If you go faster than the speed limit you are still "speeding." You can still "fail to stop" for a red light / stop sign and you can certainly still be pulled over by a grumpy cop and issued a citation for anything.


Be smart, be safe, and don't be a dick.


Those are my words for you.


(of course, the same holds true for LEOs with a Blue Light Permit for their personal vehicle, but the SJC has already ruled that activation of a blue light constitutes a "seizure" in the eyes of the law... and these two conclusions are in direct contradiction to each other... a subject which I would love to explain and debate in length, but will spare you the pleasure.)
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
Mrlunchbox said:
Excellent Zack! Those were the laws I was reading about a while ago. You hit the nail on the head with everything you said.

Thanks!


But what can I say... it's not every day that someone actually *wants* to hear me explain the law to them.


;)
 

GVFD82X12

Member
Mar 31, 2011
85
Massachusetts USA
Thanks Everyone!


I know nobody in my Dept. Runs white except for a R/C dash Light.


I also would never even WANT to run any blue anywhere.


I will check with my loval state PD and see what they have to say, then let the fun begin :)
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
GVFD82X12 said:
Thanks Everyone!

I know nobody in my Dept. Runs white except for a R/C dash Light.


I also would never even WANT to run any blue anywhere.


I will check with my loval state PD and see what they have to say, then let the fun begin :)


Now is a good time to build a (good) relationship with your local PD. Start with them and ask. (Unless you don't have a local PD, but even then, you will probably get a different explanation from every Trooper you ask.)


Just out of curiosity, what part of MA are you in? (you can PM me if you don't want to make it public)
 

gman021

Member
Dec 8, 2010
648
CT
GVFD82X12 said:
Thanks Everyone!

I know nobody in my Dept. Runs white except for a R/C dash Light.


I also would never even WANT to run any blue anywhere.


I will check with my loval state PD and see what they have to say, then let the fun begin :)

Does your dept. let you run sirens?
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
ems60 said:
One other thing to note, your red light permit expires every two years I think, so it has to be renewed.

Yes, they now expire with and have to be renewed at the same time as, the vehicle registration.


(I forget what they were before... but they were good for a block of time, 4 years?... and would be renewed independently.)
 
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StEaLtH2

Member
Mar 3, 2011
2,159
New England
Bravo... :yes: :dielaugh:


eloquent execution of the law.................. :haha:


I also agree word for word......
 

BlueLineEnt

New Member
May 23, 2010
118
Danvers, MA
540CMR22.06 prohibits clear, with exceptions for Chapter 90 Sec 7E. However, with this being said you have a red light permit, you are fine. Anyone without a red or blue light permit, cannot run clear. Pay specific attention the the section I put in Bold.


22.06: Mounting and Display of Amber and Other Colored Lights


(1) No person shall mount or display a flashing, rotating or oscillating amber light on a motor vehicle operated on the way, except as provided in 540 CMR 22.06.


(2) Flashing, rotating or oscillating amber light(s) may be mounted and displayed on:


(a) motor vehicles used for emergency or service purposes operated by members or employees of an auxiliary police force, charitable organizations, private burglar alarm companies, private detective and private security agencies, agencies of the Commonwealth or its politicalsubdivisions, persons and garages providing motorists assistance services or towing services, public and private utility companies for emergency or service purposes, persons and companies that are transporting human blood or organs for emergency purposes, oxygen, explosives or other hazardous materials;


( B) motor vehicles that have the owner's name displayed so as to be plainly visible from each side or from the front and rear of the motor vehicle, and which are actually engaged in the performance of a service, public or private, where the display of such lights would be in the best interest of public safety; and


© such other motor vehicles as authorized by written permit of the Registrar, which shall be carried by the operator upon his or her person or in the vehicle in some easily accessible place.


No person shall mount or display any flashing, rotating or oscillating light of any color other than


amber, except blue and red lights as provided in M.G.L. c. 90, § 7E, unless by written permit of the Registrar, which shall be carried by the operator upon his or her person or in the vehicle, in some easily accessible place.



(3) The Registrar may order the removal of any colored light, including amber, at anytime he deems necessary, upon written notice to the registrant, with a copy to the chief of police where said motor vehicle is principally garaged. Any registrant so notified, who fails to remove such colored lights, and who operates or permits the operation of such lights on the public way, shall be in violation of the Registrar's rules and regulations as provided in M.G.L. c. 90, §20.


(4) For purposes of 540 CMR 2.06, the following are not considered flashing, rotating or oscillating lights as restricted by M.G.L. c. 90, § 7 and do not require a permit to be issued by the Registrar:


(a) a flashing strobe light stop signal arm attached to a school bus in compliance with 49 CFRPart 571; or


( B) a modulating motorcycle headlight mounted and operated on a motorcycle, in compliance with Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard # 108, 49 CFR 571.108.


For reference Ch90 Section 7E


Section 7E. No motor vehicle operated pursuant to section seven other than fire apparatus, ambulances, school buses, vehicles specified in section seven D used for transporting school children, and vehicles specified in section seven I shall mount or display a flashing, rotating or oscillating red light in any direction, except as herein provided; provided, however, that nothing in this section shall prohibit an official police vehicle from displaying a flashing, rotating or oscillating red light in the opposite direction in which the vehicle is proceeding or prohibit fire apparatus from displaying a flashing, rotating or oscillating blue light in the opposite direction in which the vehicle is proceeding.


A vehicle owned or operated by a forest warden, deputy forest warden, a chief or deputy chief of a municipal fire department, a chaplain of a municipal fire department, a member of a fire department of a town or a call member of a fire department or a member or a call member of an emergency medical service may have mounted thereon flashing, rotating or oscillating red lights. Such lights shall only be displayed when such owner or operator is proceeding to a fire or in response to an alarm and when the official duty of such owner or operator requires him to proceed to said fire or to respond to said alarm, and at no other time.


No such red light shall be mounted or displayed on such vehicle until proper application has been made to the registrar by the head of the fire department and a written permit has been issued and delivered to the owner and operator. In the event that the operator is not the registered owner of the vehicle, no permit shall be issued until said owner forwards to the registrar a written statement certifying that he has knowledge that such red light will be mounted and displayed on said vehicle.


Any person operating a vehicle upon which flashing, rotating or oscillating red lights herein authorized are mounted shall have the permit for said lights upon his person or in the vehicle in some easily accessible place. Upon termination of the duties which warranted the issuance of the permit, the head of the fire department shall immediately notify the registrar who shall forthwith revoke such red light permit. Upon the written request of the chief of police or chief of fire of the town in which such permitted vehicle is registered, the registrar may revoke such permit. The registrar shall revoke such permit for the unauthorized use of such red lights and the owner and operator shall be subject to a fine as hereinafter provided.


Upon revocation, the registrar of motor vehicles shall notify forthwith the owner and operator of the vehicle for which such permit was issued and the head of the police department and fire department of the town in which his original permit was issued.


No motor vehicle or trailer except (i) a vehicle used solely for official business by any police department of the commonwealth or its political subdivisions or by any railroad police department or college or university police department whose officers are appointed as special state police officers by the colonel of state police pursuant to section sixty-three of chapter twenty-two C and subject to such special rules and regulations applicable to such college or university police department as the registrar may prescribe, (ii) a vehicle owned and operated by a police officer of any town or any agency of the commonwealth while on official duty and when authorized by the officer’s police chief or agency head and only by authority of a permit issued by the registrar, (iii) a vehicle operated by a duly appointed medical examiner or a physician or surgeon attached to a police department of any city or town only while on official duty and only by authority of a permit issued by the registrar, (iv) a vehicle operated by a police commissioner of a police department of any city only while on official duty and only by authority of a permit issued by the registrar, (v) a vehicle actually being used for the transportation of persons who are under arrest, or in lawful custody under authority of any court, or committed to penal or mental institutions, and only by authority of a permit issued by the registrar, (vi) a vehicle operated by a chaplain of a municipal police department while on official duty and only by authority of a permit issued by the registrar shall mount or display a flashing, rotating or oscillating blue light in any direction. No motor vehicle, as hereinbefore provided, requiring a permit from the registrar, shall mount or display a blue light on such vehicle until proper application has been made to the registrar by the head of the police department and such written permit has been issued and delivered to the owner and operator. Such notice shall include the place of residence and address of the owner and operator of the vehicle for which such permit is issued and the name of the make, vehicle identification number and the registration number of the vehicle for which such permit authorizes the display of blue lights. Any person operating a vehicle upon which blue lights have been authorized to be mounted or displayed, by permit, shall carry such permit for said lights upon his person or in the vehicle in some easily accessible place. Upon termination of the duties of such person which warranted the issuance of the permit, the chief of police shall immediately notify the registrar, who shall forthwith revoke such blue light permit. Upon the written request of the chief of police of the town in which such permitted vehicle is registered the registrar may revoke such permit. The registrar shall revoke such permit for the unauthorized use of such blue lights and the owner and operator shall be subject to a fine as hereinafter provided. Upon revocation, the registrar of motor vehicles shall notify forthwith the owner and operator of the vehicle for which such permit was issued and the head of the police department of the city or town in which such permitted vehicle is registered. Upon receipt of his notice of revocation, such owner and operator shall forthwith deliver such blue light permit to the registrar and he shall not be eligible for reissuance of such permit without consent of the head of the police department of the town in which his original permit was issued. Nothing in this section shall authorize any owner or operator to disregard or violate any statute, ordinance, by-law, rule or regulation regarding motor vehicles or their use on ways of the commonwealth. The registrar may also make such rules and regulations governing or prohibiting the display of such other lights on motor vehicles as he may deem necessary for public safety.


Any person who violates any provision of this section for which a penalty is not otherwise provided shall be subject to a fine of not less than one hundred dollars, nor more than three hundred dollars.
 
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Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
BlueLineEnt said:
540CMR22.06 prohibits clear, with exceptions for Chapter 90 Sec 7E. However, with this being said you have a red light permit, you are fine. Anyone without a red or blue light permit, cannot run clear. Pay specific attention the the section I put in Bold.


22.06: Mounting and Display of Amber and Other Colored Lights


(1) No person shall mount or display a flashing, rotating or oscillating amber light on a motor vehicle operated on the way, except as provided in 540 CMR 22.06.


(2) Flashing, rotating or oscillating amber light(s) may be mounted and displayed on:


(a) motor vehicles used for emergency or service purposes operated by members or employees of an auxiliary police force, charitable organizations, private burglar alarm companies, private detective and private security agencies, agencies of the Commonwealth or its politicalsubdivisions, persons and garages providing motorists assistance services or towing services, public and private utility companies for emergency or service purposes, persons and companies that are transporting human blood or organs for emergency purposes, oxygen, explosives or other hazardous materials;


( B) motor vehicles that have the owner's name displayed so as to be plainly visible from each side or from the front and rear of the motor vehicle, and which are actually engaged in the performance of a service, public or private, where the display of such lights would be in the best interest of public safety; and


© such other motor vehicles as authorized by written permit of the Registrar, which shall be carried by the operator upon his or her person or in the vehicle in some easily accessible place.


No person shall mount or display any flashing, rotating or oscillating light of any color other than


amber, except blue and red lights as provided in M.G.L. c. 90, § 7E, unless by written permit of the Registrar, which shall be carried by the operator upon his or her person or in the vehicle, in some easily accessible place.



(3) The Registrar may order the removal of any colored light, including amber, at anytime he deems necessary, upon written notice to the registrant, with a copy to the chief of police where said motor vehicle is principally garaged. Any registrant so notified, who fails to remove such colored lights, and who operates or permits the operation of such lights on the public way, shall be in violation of the Registrar's rules and regulations as provided in M.G.L. c. 90, §20.


(4) For purposes of 540 CMR 2.06, the following are not considered flashing, rotating or oscillating lights as restricted by M.G.L. c. 90, § 7 and do not require a permit to be issued by the Registrar:


(a) a flashing strobe light stop signal arm attached to a school bus in compliance with 49 CFRPart 571; or


( B) a modulating motorcycle headlight mounted and operated on a motorcycle, in compliance with Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standard # 108, 49 CFR 571.108.

Sure... but are *you* going to tell them?


;)


[Broken External Image]:http://homepage.mac.com/kefkafloyd/valleyroads/images/20w_mahitruck.jpg
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
I want to expand on the Siren law because I'm a big law nerd and read something interesting today...


As I stated earlier, MGL Ch 90 Sec 16 prohibits the *mounting* of a siren except for emergency vehicles. I double checked my L.E.D. reference (LEOs from MA will probably be familiar with this) and it also cites MGL Ch 90 Sec 71, which it states covers what is lawful vs. unlawful *use* of a siren.


Although all my searches for Ch 90 Sec 71 have proved unfruitful.


I'm going to try to sum up what Vol/Call FFs in Massachusetts need to know about emergency lighting:


1) A permit is required and it must be current and on-hand in the vehicle. This permit is not just for the "display" of flashing emergency lights, but also the "mounting" of them. Failure to have a permit issued, or the inability to present it on request will net you a $300 fine and confiscation of the lights. (MGL Ch. 90 Sec 7e)


2) There is no such thing as a "Siren Permit" in the Commonwealth, however vehicles owned by Vol/Call FFs are permitted to mount one. They are illegal for "civilians." Generally a "Red Light Permit" will be seen as a make-shift "Siren Permit" for LEOs. (MGL Ch 90 Sec 16)


3) A Red Light Permit allows only for the mounting of Red flashing lights. Nothing else. Generally speaking any holder of a "Red Light Permit" will not have issue mounting or displaying White and Amber in conjunction. These colors are covered under their own respective laws (or not permitted at all), but I think I can speak for most LEOs in MA that a Red Light Permit will "supersede" any prohibitions on those other colors. If you have a Red Light Permit, I think you'd be hard pressed to find a cop who will cite you for illegal use of a flashing white light. (MGL Ch 90 Sec 16, 540CMR22.06)


4) Don't even think about running Blue in any direction. Not only will you quickly get the attention of LEOs, you start to run into the realm of "Unlawful Search and Seizure" thanks to a MA SJC ruling... and if not that, an easy case can be made for impersonation of a LEO. Oh, and it's explicitly illegal. (MGL Ch 90 Sec 7e)


5) A Red Light Permit *does not* allow the operator of a personal vehicle to violate *any* motor vehicle laws of the Commonwealth. You are still responsible to obey any and all traffic laws, and if not, can be cited accordingly. (The law regulating the operation of an "Emergency Vehicle" can be found in MGL Ch 89 Sec 7b)


6) Most departments have their own policies regarding what types of lights/sirens can be mounted. Learn them.


7) The best indication of what your setup should be like is the setups of other members of your department.


8) Red Light Permits are issued and revoked at the discretion of the Department Chief and the Registrar of Motor Vehicles. Piss off the wrong person and it could come back to haunt you.


9) And as with anything in this business; Be safe, be smart, and don't be a dick.


(*Note: There are specific laws governing department emergency vehicles, and under what circumstances they can lawfully use their warning equipment and/or violate traffic law. Violation of these laws don't carry fines or criminal charges, but you can still be cited under the respective MGLs and could have it held against you in Dept discipline or Civil litigation. I'll see if I can find the MGL that covers these...)
 
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emtanderson51

Member
Apr 9, 2011
3,795
USA Massachusetts
I worked in Oxford, MA for 7 years and ran a 9M with a combo of red clear and amber and a 295hfsa6 200w siren w/ 2 speakers and was fully treated as an emergency vehicle. I was able to exceed speed limits (due regard) and proceed through red traffic signals (after complete stop) and never had a single problem in all the time I ran with them. I can't count the amount of times I responded with the PD to a scene when I was too far to get to the ambulance. Absolutely NO blue. Direct from the Oxford Police chief. Oh, and no insurance if you crash while responding so keep that in mind...
 
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Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
BlueLineEnt said:
I think you may have missed the line the paragraph [ 2(a)] that says "agencies of the Commonwealth" :)

Very good summation of Mass' red light laws, I think that sums up everything quite well and is a good guide.

I don't know, the way I read that CMR is that there is no provision for white... even for "agencies of the Commonwealth." That CMR only outlines use of Amber, and then mentions 90/7e for Red and Blue.


(I was using the picture to display the Mass Highway / MassDOT's usage of white in the rear corner modules of their bars, both older strobes and newer liberties.)
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
emtanderson51 said:
I worked in Oxford, MA for 7 years and ran a 9M with a combo of red clear and amber and a 295hfsa6 200w siren w/ 2 speakers and was fully treated as an emergency vehicle. I was able to exceed speed limits (due regard) and proceed through red traffic signals (after complete stop) and never had a single problem in all the time I ran with them. I can't count the amount of times I responded with the PD to a scene when I was too far to get to the ambulance. Absolutely NO blue. Direct from the Oxford Police chief. Oh, and no insurance if you crash while responding so keep that in mind...

Don't get me wrong, I know how people *treat* pov's with lights in them... I'm no stranger to this.


But the truth (read: "law") is that any lights are only a POV so you are technically not allowed to exceed the speed limit. Do people do it? Yeah, all day long... but it's important to know that it's in violation.

C420sailor said:
If red lights are courtesy lights, why have a siren? So you can sit at a stop light with your siren blaring?

Because the purpose of a "courtesy light" is to request the right-of-way from other drivers. Just like when you come to a 4-way stop at the exact same time as someone else, and they decide to be nice and give you the right-of-way....


You can use a siren to help alert other drivers to your request of the right of way.


Say I'm in my personal vehicle with my lights and siren going. I come to a red light. If I leave my warning equipment on, and then everyone else at the intersection (with green lights) stops and decides to yield the right of way to me, than that's good to go. Everyone at the intersection has essentially agreed that I should be the first one through.


The same type of yielding occurs for funeral professions.


The rub is that if you then proceed through the red and someone (with a green) who *hadn't* yielded to you collides with your vehicle... you are at fault.
 

BlueLineEnt

New Member
May 23, 2010
118
Danvers, MA
Zack said:
I don't know, the way I read that CMR is that there is no provision for white... even for "agencies of the Commonwealth." That CMR only outlines use of Amber, and then mentions 90/7e for Red and Blue.

(I was using the picture to display the Mass Highway / MassDOT's usage of white in the rear corner modules of their bars, both older strobes and newer liberties.)

Very true, I just re-read it, and you're exactly spot on. I'm sure there is some other obscure law that they have drafted for themselves to keep white. It's interesting because you see amber and white on the rear of everything they have, buy I feel that amber and red would be more effective, especially with LED technology now making RED the brightest color visible on sunny days.
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
BlueLineEnt said:
Very true, I just re-read it, and you're exactly spot on. I'm sure there is some other obscure law that they have drafted for themselves to keep white. It's interesting because you see amber and white on the rear of everything they have, buy I feel that amber and red would be more effective, especially with LED technology now making RED the brightest color visible on sunny days.

Oh... good point. They very easily could have created a 720 CMR to allow their use of white.


I agree on your assessment of colors. They would be much better served by replacing the white with red, if not just for increased contrast in colors.
 

BlueLineEnt

New Member
May 23, 2010
118
Danvers, MA
I just found this and I believe it debunks idea that red lights are a courtesy light. It is MGL Chapter 89, Section 7.


Section 7. The members and apparatus of a fire department while going to a fire or responding to an alarm, police patrol vehicles and ambulances, and ambulances on a call for the purpose of hospitalizing a sick or injured person shall have the right of way through any street, way, lane or alley. Whoever wilfully obstructs or retards the passage of any of the foregoing in the exercise of such right shall be punished by a fine of fifty dollars or by imprisonment for not more than three months for the first offense and by a fine of not more than five hundred dollars or by imprisonment for up to one year for a second and subsequent offenses; provided, however, that for a third or subsequent offense the court or the registry of motor vehicles, in addition to any such fine or imprisonment, may suspend the license of the person so convicted and may order mandatory classroom retraining in motor vehicle and traffic laws.


By "members & apparatus" I would argue that the term "members" would also refer to members driving in their own vehicles. I am by no means saying this is how the state interprets it, its just more food for thought and consideration. I also wouldn't interpret it to mean you can speed, or go the wrong way up a one way street for example, as mentioned above, but I would believe it to mean people must pull over, or clear an intersection and yield the right of way for a POV with valid red lights.
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
BlueLineEnt said:
I just found this and I believe it debunks idea that red lights are a courtesy light. It is MGL Chapter 89, Section 7.

Section 7. The members and apparatus of a fire department while going to a fire or responding to an alarm, police patrol vehicles and ambulances, and ambulances on a call for the purpose of hospitalizing a sick or injured person shall have the right of way through any street, way, lane or alley. Whoever wilfully obstructs or retards the passage of any of the foregoing in the exercise of such right shall be punished by a fine of fifty dollars or by imprisonment for not more than three months for the first offense and by a fine of not more than five hundred dollars or by imprisonment for up to one year for a second and subsequent offenses; provided, however, that for a third or subsequent offense the court or the registry of motor vehicles, in addition to any such fine or imprisonment, may suspend the license of the person so convicted and may order mandatory classroom retraining in motor vehicle and traffic laws.


By "members & apparatus" I would argue that the term "members" would also refer to members driving in their own vehicles. I am by no means saying this is how the state interprets it, its just more food for thought and consideration. I also wouldn't interpret it to mean you can speed, or go the wrong way up a one way street for example, as mentioned above, but I would believe it to mean people must pull over, or clear an intersection and yield the right of way for a POV with valid red lights.

Very interesting. I would also think the word "members" would imply a person in their personal vehicle... although if you read that law verbatim it seems to suggest that police cars, even when not responding to an emergency, have the right-of-way.


I need to track down a copy of the Red Light Permit Application form... there is some additional wording on the form itself, and I can't recall if it cites the MGL or not...
 

Zoe

Member
May 28, 2010
776
Deerfield MA
BlueLineEnt said:
I just found this and I believe it debunks idea that red lights are a courtesy light. It is MGL Chapter 89, Section 7.

Section 7. The members and apparatus of a fire department while going to a fire or responding to an alarm, police patrol vehicles and ambulances, and ambulances on a call for the purpose of hospitalizing a sick or injured person shall have the right of way through any street, way, lane or alley. Whoever wilfully obstructs or retards the passage of any of the foregoing in the exercise of such right shall be punished by a fine of fifty dollars or by imprisonment for not more than three months for the first offense and by a fine of not more than five hundred dollars or by imprisonment for up to one year for a second and subsequent offenses; provided, however, that for a third or subsequent offense the court or the registry of motor vehicles, in addition to any such fine or imprisonment, may suspend the license of the person so convicted and may order mandatory classroom retraining in motor vehicle and traffic laws.


By "members & apparatus" I would argue that the term "members" would also refer to members driving in their own vehicles. I am by no means saying this is how the state interprets it, its just more food for thought and consideration. I also wouldn't interpret it to mean you can speed, or go the wrong way up a one way street for example, as mentioned above, but I would believe it to mean people must pull over, or clear an intersection and yield the right of way for a POV with valid red lights.

Okay, so I checked the Red Light Permit Application and while it does not cite a specific MGL, it does clearly stated that the holder of the permit is not allowed to violate any traffic law.


And while 89/7 as you cited does use the phrase "members" of a fire department have the right of way... 89/7a only states "Fire Apparatus" when listing what vehicles civilians must pull to the right and stop for and 89/7b only lists the "driver of a vehicle of a fire [...] department" when listing who is exempt from motor vehicle law.


I think that your quote from 89/7 is stating that when there is a questions of right-of-way (like 4 people come to a 4-way stop intersection at the same time), those listed have the right of way. Hence the listing of police vehicles and ambulances but with no reference to "while responding to an emergency." It's not that "members" of the department always have the right of way above all other laws... just when there is a toss-up of who should go first.


Furthermore, 89/7a and 89/7b clearly state that the only vehicles with any sort of authority to violate law and to which other's are required to stop and pull over no matter where they are, are vehicles belonging to a department (and not personal vehicles).


So, even though there isn't an MGL that clearly states that a personal vehicle's red light is only a "curtesy" light, I think that it can be deduced from the other laws which clearly state who does have authority.
 

emtanderson51

Member
Apr 9, 2011
3,795
USA Massachusetts
White or clear warning lights are permitted under the blue and red light laws. They are not permitted alone, with amber or without said red/blue light permit.
 

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