2003 Hond Civic POV Project

squints

Member
Feb 4, 2019
15
Omaha, NE
I'd like to get everyone's input on all aspects for what I'm considering for my POV build out.

I'm currently driving a 2003 Honda Civic sedan that I'll use for responding directly to station (no parking on street at scene). I'd like to not drill as many holes as possible, and keep it looking as stock/least whacker-ish as possible from the outside (no roof lightbars).


Currently working on a budget of approximately $1k-$1.1k total for equipment and installation. I’m not against used equipment, but everything I’ve listed below is priced out as new. State law allows POVs to run red, blue, & requires a siren if running lights and 360 degree visibility.


For sirens/controllers I've been looking into ones that are handheld or have a remote head so that I can mount the “brain” in my trunk and keep/mount the controller in my center console. Since I’m responding directly to station, I don’t need a Mode 1, Mode 2 or Mode 3 for my lighting, just an on/off. Models I've considered are the Feniex Typhoon Handheld, Sho-Me 8-Function Undercover (31.2515) Federal Signal SS2000SM, & Code 3 RLS 3997.


As far as lighting, given the small size of my windshield, a traditional visor bar will not fit. One option I’m considering is the Feniex Typhoon Handheld (even though their tones don’t sound great) paired with the Feniex 2x's set to steady burn, with the wig-wag function of the Typhoon enabled, flashing the 2x’s.


I know that Feniex has a mixed reputation (especially on this board), so that’s why I’m considering all alternatives.


Equipment (all purchased through FEVER’s online store):

  • 1 Feniex Typhoon Handheld - $ 199
  • 1 Feniex Triton Speaker - $99
  • 1 Feniex 2x R/R 40 degree - $139
  • 1 Feniex 2x B/B 40 degree - $139
  • 2 Feniex FSM Dual Color R/B 40 degree - $158
  • 1 SNM Intersection License Plate Bracket - $29
  • 3 Feniex T3's in red - $106.5
  • 1 Feniex T3 in blue - $35.50
Shipping: Free

Total Price: $905



Mounting:

  • Triton speaker mounted behind grille (grille doesn’t have a lot of openings or space for mounting, so may mount it on top of license plate intersection bracket)
  • 1 FSM mounted on either side of UBL intersection bracket
  • Red 2x mounted on driver side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Blue 2x mounted on passenger side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Red T3s pointing out rear windows mounted to B pillar with L brackets
  • Red and Blue T3s mounted on either side of 3rd brake light on rear deck with L brackets

Controller Setup:

  • Output 1 & 2 set to wig-wag on Quad Flash Combo pattern
  • Output 1: Driver side 2x
  • Output 2: Passenger side 2x
  • Output 3: FSM's and B pillar T3's
  • Output 5: Rear deck T3's

Patterns:
  • 2x's: Set to steady burn & controlled by Typhoon wig-wag set to Quad Flash Combo
  • FSM's: Colors 1& 2 Triple Combo No off Time
  • B Pillar T3's: Attack 1
  • Rear Deck T3's: Attack 1 (synced with red as master and blue as slave)
 

tsquale

Lifetime VIP Donor
Oct 12, 2010
10,534
Minnesota, USA
I think your placement ideas sound good and well thought out. Personally, I would try and source used Whelen, Fed Sig, or SoundOff before I would use Feniex. While I haven't used Feniex on a personal vehicle, I have on a squad car I used and I wasn't a fan (both durability and output wise). You can buy a nice used Avenger dual for the price of the Feniex stuff and it will be brighter. Again, just what I personally would do. I think you have the bases covered otherwise.
 

pdk9

Member
May 26, 2010
3,834
New York & Florida
Lighting looks pretty good, but I just made a tweak to your side/intersection warning and added slim grill light (since budget is limited, I would say to add the grill lights last when $ permits)
  • Red 2x mounted on driver side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Blue 2x mounted on passenger side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Duo Red/Blue SNM crescents under the side mirrors (side and intersection warning)
  • Brookings ES6 (1 red and 1 blue) in grill slots. They’re very narrow (only 2/3 of an inch tall) and you can prob use some 3M tape with brackets to mount
  • Red and Blue T3s mounted on either side of 3rd brake light on rear deck with L brackets

What about the Code 3 3900 speaker? I don’t love C3, but their new speaker is only about 1.5” thick. I think a speaker mounted on an intersection bracket would look tacky and be very flimsy

An alternative to the Feniex handheld is the mini 4200 tied to a typhoon siren. I don’t love their tones either, but it’s more functional than the sho-me 8 function, and you won’t find another combo siren/controller for < $200 (unless it’s a “private” brand)
 
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Carlos SpicyWeiner

Lifetime VIP Donor
May 3, 2012
5,233
Lakeland, Florida
For the love of god please make sure your account on our site is set up for the ELB discount. If it's not once the account is created PM me your e-mail address you used. No reason you should pay full price :)
 

squints

Member
Feb 4, 2019
15
Omaha, NE
I think your placement ideas sound good and well thought out. Personally, I would try and source used Whelen, Fed Sig, or SoundOff before I would use Feniex. While I haven't used Feniex on a personal vehicle, I have on a squad car I used and I wasn't a fan (both durability and output wise). You can buy a nice used Avenger dual for the price of the Feniex stuff and it will be brighter. Again, just what I personally would do. I think you have the bases covered otherwise.

Thanks for the input. A guy at my station has had some Viper S2's sitting around our tool room and I may see if he'll let 1 or 2 go if you think that would be better than the 2x's. I still may go for the t3's on the B pillar and rear deck since they aren't as high of a priority.

For the love of god please make sure your account on our site is set up for the ELB discount. If it's not once the account is created PM me your e-mail address you used. No reason you should pay full price :)

That would be great, Given the other's opinions I may or may not go with the full order, but I'll for sure go with some. In your opinion, what do you think of that SNM Intersection Bracket? I'm pretty set on picking one up, but what I should put on the side is still up in the air. Additionally, do you think it's sturdy enough to mount a siren to if it doesn't fit behind the grille?


Screen_Shot_2018-06-22_at_12.04.39_PM.png


Lighting looks pretty good, but I just made a tweak to your side/intersection warning Red 2x mounted on driver side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Blue 2x mounted on passenger side beneath visor w/ permanent mount kit
  • Duo Red/Blue SNM crescents under the side mirrors (side and intersection warning)
  • Brookings ES6 (1 red and 1 blue) in grill slots. They’re very narrow (only 2/3 of an inch tall) and you can prob use some 3M tape with brackets to mount
  • Red and Blue T3s mounted on either side of 3rd brake light on rear deck with L brackets

I'd thought about under mirror lights, but it seems like if I'm installing myself, that they may be more hassle than they're worth. May go with them on my next vehicle though.

I do agree that the siren on top of the above intersection bracket would be tacky, so mounting it there would be a last resort.

As far as the C3900, it's less about the thickness and more about the height. The angle of the grille is relatively aggressive, but I may have found a spot to mount. See pictures below

Screen Shot 2019-10-30 at 10.35.29 PM.png

1312340495.jpg


004.jpg
 

Carlos SpicyWeiner

Lifetime VIP Donor
May 3, 2012
5,233
Lakeland, Florida
I don't know about mounting a siren speaker to the SNM bracket. 1) you'd need to make sure you could get all 4 mounting points of the SNM bracket into something solid (thick metal).

2) the SNM bracket is not nearly as thick or heavy duty as the speaker bracket so it would be questionable. For mounting lights, it's great.

it looks like there is some area below the bumper behind the bumper cover or at least in the fender well to mount the speaker. I generally hate mounting speakers behind a bumper cover unless there is an opening but sometimes its the only option.

In regards to Feniex, they've had their ups and downs. At risk of putting my close personal friendship with the owner of this site (Who also built and helps maintain my site) on the line, ELB overall is starting to change based on his opinions being posted. Some of that opinion I'll completely chalk up to bitterness in the way the employment situation went. Some is justifiable. My personal opinion? Yes, some of the products are completely imported. Others are assembled, etc.

That said, this seems to be par the course in the industry right now. The only two companies I believe are truly making more than 90% of their stuff in the states is Star and Whelen. Star's been around for over 100 years and had time to slowly acquire things it needs to really do everything in house and Whelen is just a mammoth giant with endless funds. Star makes a good product, but does poorly on their marketing and some of their products don't look as sexy as other manufacturers. Whelen CERTAINLY has its faults. They benefit from being able to use their vast resources to either create new products or take a competitors idea and rapidly move it into production so they don't fall behind.

While imported products are generally thought of to be substandard, the gap between manufacturing techniques abroad and those in the US are not as big as they once were due to the shift of our economy. I personally love soundoff and would consider them #2. They import a significant amount of product. Federal Signal has been importing product for a while, yet we never hear complaints about these companies doing it. Its simply because of the equity they've built up over the years with consumers.

In the interest of full transparency, Feniex does some stuff sometimes that absolutely floors me. A lot of that is based on how I feel they interact with their own distributors though so I won't get into that here. Some of the growing anti Feniex sentiment though is coming from some of the distributors they have because of the moves they've made to compete with their own dealers.

I have grown frustrated with the shift of products and firmware changes that causes them not to interact together. That said, they are finally correcting issues we have been begging for to be corrected. In order to do that, you have to deal with the change. Overall quality coming from them has improved significantly. I use to blatantly refuse to sell any full lightbars coming from them on any builds I was doing until the GPL was released. Since the GPL release, I've had two issues with the bar in all of the ones I've sold/installed. 1) was some sort of freak thing where it kept burning up 4200's through the cat 5 cable. 2) is I had 3 bars (from the same lot) have the tops rust on them. This seems like it was a supplier issue more than anything but it was disappointing. That said, they handled the RMA's to my satisfaction.

My very real and honest assessment of your list:
  • 1 Feniex Typhoon Handheld - The first batch seemed to have issues. I haven't had any that have had issues as of yet, but I also didn't buy any initially because I had a large stock of Star Handhelds. The star LCS869 handheld is slightly more expensive but has a longer track record. I've had one star handheld go bad and I think that was because someone pulled the cord too tight.
  • 1 Feniex Triton Speaker - To me, these things are some of the best deals in the industry. I've replaced more failed whelen speakers than I have Triton speakers.
  • 1 Feniex 2x R/R 40 degree - The 2x is just two Feniex surface mounts on a different housing. Biggest problem I see is people changing patterns too fast on them and one module getting out of sync. It was a stupid silly issue to have in a dash light. The good thing is the new firmwares make it easy to get them back in sync by holding the pattern change down for a 5 seconds and it resets them. Optics choice are key with this light. People here use to compare the Feniex Apollo to Avengers and say they were lack luster. Then they'd never go back to feniex because we also had idiotic and untruthful dealers telling people the apollo (180° optics) were just as bright as the cobra (40° optics) head on. This was a BLATANT lie... and the only reason I can see why anyone would say that is because at the time they were more expensive. (higher price = higher profit). Realize what you need the dash light to do and judge it accordingly. My other beef with the 2x is I've never been a fan of suction cups. This seems to be fixed with the "permanent mount" 3m VHB tape option and I'd strongly suggest using that. People will compare the MSRP of the 2x and say it's cheaper than an avenger... but keep in mind you won't pay MSRP for the 2x.
  • 1 Feniex 2x B/B 40 degree - See above.
  • 2 Feniex FSM Dual Color R/B 40 degree - I've had one bad fusion surface mount (never powered on right out of the bag. To me, this seems to be the M.O. lately for Feniex failures (Not true for the early Apollo, Cobra, and Python stuff) Most failures I've had simply didn't function correctly out off the box rather than 6 months later. I've also only had one Fusion Surface Mount Module fill with moisture and stay filled. Florida is really wet, hot, and SUPER humid. The whelen stuff I had on my patrol car stayed filled with water. The 500 series mirror beams may have been installation error from our fleet section but the number of LINZ6's we had filled with water was ridiculous (I'm pretty sure our fleet at the sheriff's office did not have ONE mounted on the outside without water in it two years later). Keep in mind, some of the newer optics now hide moisture better than others. The biggest thing I've seen fix this with the surface mount? Don't use the rubber gasket pad and don't over tight the head to the mounting point. This allows the one way breather sticker on the back to do its job.
  • 1 SNM Intersection License Plate Bracket - Already discussed above.
  • 3 Feniex T3's in red - Remember what I said about the Triton? yeah... multiple that by 100 for the T3. I've sold over 1000 of these things and have literally only seen or been told of 4 failing. Two of those were preproduction models we had from feniex 6 months before they were released. Our failures in testing lead to a delay in production so they could fix the issue. That said, I do know of other dealers that had a bad batch of them that either not worked right out of the package or shortly after. We luckily were not affected by that. If there is one thing I'd knock them for is sometimes the finish can start to lighten up some and they turn more gray than black over time but it's not drastic.
  • 1 Feniex T3 in blue - See above.

We sell Star, SoundOff, and Tecniq too. The Soundoff Mpowers are also an excellent line (significantly more expensive) as well. I'm also a fan of the Star Microstar line. We sell tri color models for as much as the Feniex Fusion Dual colors. They are super thin, but overall don't look as attractive as the fusion surface mounts. Star has always been good to me and overall I like dealing with them despite some of the lead time issues I see here and there. They are more personal to me than SOS... but I think that's just something more on the distributor side of things.

On that note, when I was hospitalized for a critical on duty related injury, Hamza and Louis from Feniex checked on me more than anyone probably. Even sent stuff to my hospital. Hamza's also reached out and offered other assistance personally for that injury. At that time, I felt like Feniex cared more about me than my own agency (I had zero calls/visits from my agency's leadership during my hospitalization). The Star rep checked on me, and I met with the VP of sales for Star a month later who was super compassionate as well. Oh... and Jman (owner of this site) came to visit me a couple times as well. There is a reason we are close friends.

I do feel like overall Feniex cares about trying to help public safety. I honestly feel like Feniex's leadership really has a passion about helping protect LEO's. I just think they experience some growing pains and have some misteps. You are looking at a mom and pop business (Feniex is not exactly mom and pop) trying to compete with amazon (Whelen isn't as large as amazon, but figure market share and resources).

I'll say this.... no ONE manufacturer in this industry has the best of everything. Anyone who tries to say that is full of it. Weigh everything individually against what you need. Sometimes you do get what you pay for, sometimes there are hidden values in things.
 
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squints

Member
Feb 4, 2019
15
Omaha, NE
I don't know about mounting a siren speaker to the SNM bracket. 1) you'd need to make sure you could get all 4 mounting points of the SNM bracket into something solid (thick metal).

2) the SNM bracket is not nearly as thick or heavy duty as the speaker bracket so it would be questionable. For mounting lights, it's great.

it looks like there is some area below the bumper behind the bumper cover or at least in the fender well to mount the speaker. I generally hate mounting speakers behind a bumper cover unless there is an opening but sometimes its the only option.

In regards to Feniex, they've had their ups and downs. At risk of putting my close personal friendship with the owner of this site (Who also built and helps maintain my site) on the line, ELB overall is starting to change based on his opinions being posted. Some of that opinion I'll completely chalk up to bitterness in the way the employment situation went. Some is justifiable. My personal opinion? Yes, some of the products are completely imported. Others are assembled, etc.

That said, this seems to be par the course in the industry right now. The only two companies I believe are truly making more than 90% of their stuff in the states is Star and Whelen. Star's been around for over 100 years and had time to slowly acquire things it needs to really do everything in house and Whelen is just a mammoth giant with endless funds. Star makes a good product, but does poorly on their marketing and some of their products don't look as sexy as other manufacturers. Whelen CERTAINLY has its faults. They benefit from being able to use their vast resources to either create new products or take a competitors idea and rapidly move it into production so they don't fall behind.

While imported products are generally thought of to be substandard, the gap between manufacturing techniques abroad and those in the US are not as big as they once were due to the shift of our economy. I personally love soundoff and would consider them #2. They import a significant amount of product. Federal Signal has been importing product for a while, yet we never hear complaints about these companies doing it. Its simply because of the equity they've built up over the years with consumers.

In the interest of full transparency, Feniex does some stuff sometimes that absolutely floors me. A lot of that is based on how I feel they interact with their own distributors though so I won't get into that here. Some of the growing anti Feniex sentiment though is coming from some of the distributors they have because of the moves they've made to compete with their own dealers.

I have grown frustrated with the shift of products and firmware changes that causes them not to interact together. That said, they are finally correcting issues we have been begging for to be corrected. In order to do that, you have to deal with the change. Overall quality coming from them has improved significantly. I use to blatantly refuse to sell any full lightbars coming from them on any builds I was doing until the GPL was released. Since the GPL release, I've had two issues with the bar in all of the ones I've sold/installed. 1) was some sort of freak thing where it kept burning up 4200's through the cat 5 cable. 2) is I had 3 bars (from the same lot) have the tops rust on them. This seems like it was a supplier issue more than anything but it was disappointing. That said, they handled the RMA's to my satisfaction.

My very real and honest assessment of your list:
  • 1 Feniex Typhoon Handheld - The first batch seemed to have issues. I haven't had any that have had issues as of yet, but I also didn't buy any initially because I had a large stock of Star Handhelds. The star LCS869 handheld is slightly more expensive but has a longer track record. I've had one star handheld go bad and I think that was because someone pulled the cord too tight.
  • 1 Feniex Triton Speaker - To me, these things are some of the best deals in the industry. I've replaced more failed whelen speakers than I have Triton speakers.
  • 1 Feniex 2x R/R 40 degree - The 2x is just two Feniex surface mounts on a different housing. Biggest problem I see is people changing patterns too fast on them and one module getting out of sync. It was a stupid silly issue to have in a dash light. The good thing is the new firmwares make it easy to get them back in sync by holding the pattern change down for a 5 seconds and it resets them. Optics choice are key with this light. People here use to compare the Feniex Apollo to Avengers and say they were lack luster. Then they'd never go back to feniex because we also had idiotic and untruthful dealers telling people the apollo (180° optics) were just as bright as the cobra (40° optics) head on. This was a BLATANT lie... and the only reason I can see why anyone would say that is because at the time they were more expensive. (higher price = higher profit). Realize what you need the dash light to do and judge it accordingly. My other beef with the 2x is I've never been a fan of suction cups. This seems to be fixed with the "permanent mount" 3m VHB tape option and I'd strongly suggest using that. People will compare the MSRP of the 2x and say it's cheaper than an avenger... but keep in mind you won't pay MSRP for the 2x.
  • 1 Feniex 2x B/B 40 degree - See above.
  • 2 Feniex FSM Dual Color R/B 40 degree - I've had one bad fusion surface mount (never powered on right out of the bag. To me, this seems to be the M.O. lately for Feniex failures (Not true for the early Apollo, Cobra, and Python stuff) Most failures I've had simply didn't function correctly out off the box rather than 6 months later. I've also only had one Fusion Surface Mount Module fill with moisture and stay filled. Florida is really wet, hot, and SUPER humid. The whelen stuff I had on my patrol car stayed filled with water. The 500 series mirror beams may have been installation error from our fleet section but the number of LINZ6's we had filled with water was ridiculous (I'm pretty sure our fleet at the sheriff's office did not have ONE mounted on the outside without water in it two years later). Keep in mind, some of the newer optics now hide moisture better than others. The biggest thing I've seen fix this with the surface mount? Don't use the rubber gasket pad and don't over tight the head to the mounting point. This allows the one way breather sticker on the back to do its job.
  • 1 SNM Intersection License Plate Bracket - Already discussed above.
  • 3 Feniex T3's in red - Remember what I said about the Triton? yeah... multiple that by 100 for the T3. I've sold over 1000 of these things and have literally only seen or been told of 4 failing. Two of those were preproduction models we had from feniex 6 months before they were released. Our failures in testing lead to a delay in production so they could fix the issue. That said, I do know of other dealers that had a bad batch of them that either not worked right out of the package or shortly after. We luckily were not affected by that. If there is one thing I'd knock them for is sometimes the finish can start to lighten up some and they turn more gray than black over time but it's not drastic.
  • 1 Feniex T3 in blue - See above.

We sell Star, SoundOff, and Tecniq too. The Soundoff Mpowers are also an excellent line (significantly more expensive) as well. I'm also a fan of the Star Microstar line. We sell tri color models for as much as the Feniex Fusion Dual colors. They are super thin, but overall don't look as attractive as the fusion surface mounts. Star has always been good to me and overall I like dealing with them despite some of the lead time issues I see here and there. They are more personal to me than SOS... but I think that's just something more on the distributor side of things.

On that note, when I was hospitalized for a critical on duty related injury, Hamza and Louis from Feniex checked on me more than anyone probably. Even sent stuff to my hospital. Hamza's also reached out and offered other assistance personally for that injury. At that time, I felt like Feniex cared more about me than my own agency (I had zero calls/visits from my agency's leadership during my hospitalization). The Star rep checked on me, and I met with the VP of sales for Star a month later who was super compassionate as well. Oh... and Jman (owner of this site) came to visit me a couple times as well. There is a reason we are close friends.

I do feel like overall Feniex cares about trying to help public safety. I honestly feel like Feniex's leadership really has a passion about helping protect LEO's. I just think they experience some growing pains and have some misteps. You are looking at a mom and pop business (Feniex is not exactly mom and pop) trying to compete with amazon (Whelen isn't as large as amazon, but figure market share and resources).

I'll say this.... no ONE manufacturer in this industry has the best of everything. Anyone who tries to say that is full of it. Weigh everything individually against what you need. Sometimes you do get what you pay for, sometimes there are hidden values in things.

That was extremely well thought out and honest and I really appreciate it. I'll be in contact soon
 

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