Wiring quick quetion...

[PTech]

Hey guys, if I am to connect an Siren (I use a PA300 for Federal Signal) to an speaker all this hooked through my battery. All that is possible, but there is one thing missing. The wires are not reaching. So, I went to the local market and bought an wire to extend it.


Is there any special wire? Please let me know.

 

[Jarred J.]

are you asking what kind of wire do you connect a siren to a speaker?


power wire!


vs speaker wire as in car audio...

 

[NPS Ranger]

Just buy a 2 wire extension cord at your local supermarket and cut it to length.

 

[MPD 818]

Hey guys, if I am to connect an Siren (I use a PA300 for Federal Signal) to an speaker all this hooked through my battery. All that is possible, but there is one thing missing. The wires are not reaching. So, I went to the local market and bought an wire to extend it.

Is there any special wire? Please let me know.

Newbie, from Canada, with a question about a PA 300 siren. Hmmmm. Sounds familiar.

 

[MEVS06]

Newbie, from Canada, with a question about a PA 300 siren. Hmmmm. Sounds familiar.

Hmmmmmmmm sounds very familiar.

 

[JCLG316]

If its going to a single speaker 18 Gauge if going to a dual siren go with 16 gauge. thats what I did for are brush trucks.

 

[twisted_metal]

Newbie, from Canada, with a question about a PA 300 siren. Hmmmm. Sounds familiar.

Hmmmmmmmm sounds very familiar.

 

[PTech]

are you asking what kind of wire do you connect a siren to a speaker?


power wire!


vs speaker wire as in car audio...

Not exactly speaking. I can connect everything together, siren with speaker and siren to power source. However, I use Crocodile Wires the sirens doesn't produce the sound correctly. Either I wired incorrectly or it requires heavier wires. Thus, I bought an 16' wires... would it work? If I don't try and extend the wires... everything works perfectly.

Just buy a 2 wire extension cord at your local supermarket and cut it to length.

What kind of Wire Extension? There are different length size and other feature in a wire.

If its going to a single speaker 18 Gauge if going to a dual siren go with 16 gauge. thats what I did for are brush trucks.

Thanks for the information, I bought a 16 gauge wires. I only have a single siren. Would it still works perfectly or I should of gone with 18?

 

[Jarred J.]

opcorn:

 

[fire1]

Not exactly speaking. I can connect everything together, siren with speaker and siren to power source. However, I use Crocodile Wires the sirens doesn't produce the sound correctly. Either I wired incorrectly or it requires heavier wires. Thus, I bought an 16' wires... would it work? If I don't try and extend the wires... everything works perfectly.
View attachment 16655


What kind of Wire Extension? There are different length size and other feature in a wire.


Thanks for the information, I bought a 16 gauge wires. I only have a single siren. Would it still works perfectly or I should of gone with 18?

16 gauge will work fine.

 

[SireLite]

Don't use these as if you do. Your car will set on fire.

If your ensure what to do. Find someone local who does.

 

[SlickTop Solutions]

Newbie, from Canada, with a question about a PA 300 siren. Hmmmm. Sounds familiar.

You guys beat me to it.....


opcorn:

 

[Peter F]

Nice crocodile wires,

 

[Fluffy126577]

Please, for all intensive purposes, keep the thread on topic. If you want to start a NEW topic somewhere else that's fine. There is no need to bring up the elephant in the room. Any questions, comments, or concerns please contact me directly.


Thank You.

 

[EVModules]

16 is overkill. 18g is plenty for speakers.

 

[tnems7]

And, note to moderator, the correct phrase should read "for all intents and purposes".


IMO, 18 g is sufficient speaker wire from an underdash or console- mounted siren to the speaker(s), such as a PA 300, but let us realize for a trunk-mounted siren (like an 80K) where the distance to the front-mounted speakers increases, we would prefer 16 gauge wire.


Also, the original message might be taken to imply that speaker wires could be spliced - that should be a big NO, don't do it. The wiring should only be completed with one set of crip connectors, connecting the speaker wires to the wiring harness of the siren, and then the length of wiring directly to the lugs at the speaker terminals.

 

[EVModules]

tnems7,


If you did some reading on electronic theory, you will see that it makes no difference whether it's 18g or 16g. We're talking about AC, not DC.


Regarding extending wires, is it permissible & doable? Yes, provided that you maintain the necessary quality in splicing or the use of connectors, no matter how many of them they are. Is it suggested? Not economically by a long shot by itself, no. There ARE quality hookups where there may be as many as 3 or 4 in a professional build with the use of connectors. In the OP's case, he just have two choices, do a quality extension job or replace it with a longer length.

 

[tnems7]

Good point! I had been thinking of it in the manner for DC conductors, not a the speaker (audio) feed. And in the case of professional installers using true splices, soldered connections. terminal strips, etc, it doesn't make a significant difference. But for some whackers, splices mean wire nuts, different lengths and gauges of wire, improvised connections, etc.

 

[Henry455]

tnems7,

If you did some reading on electronic theory, you will see that it makes no difference whether it's 18g or 16g. We're talking about AC, not DC.

Maybe I am missing something but I thought there is the same amount of voltage drop in a run of wire no matter if it is AC or DC. What is different in sirens is the output of the final amp is approx. 33-34 volts RMS AC. Because of the higher voltage you can use a smaller conductor for the equivalent power. I personally would use 18 gauge wire for all 100 watt sirens (33 volts at 3 amps) and all 3 wire 200 watt sirens but would use 16 gauge on a 200 watt 2 wire siren (33 volts at 6 amps) if the run was over 15 feet.

 

[PTech]

tnems7,

If you did some reading on electronic theory, you will see that it makes no difference whether it's 18g or 16g. We're talking about AC, not DC.


Regarding extending wires, is it permissible & doable? Yes, provided that you maintain the necessary quality in splicing or the use of connectors, no matter how many of them they are. Is it suggested? Not economically by a long shot by itself, no. There ARE quality hookups where there may be as many as 3 or 4 in a professional build with the use of connectors. In the OP's case, he just have two choices, do a quality extension job or replace it with a longer length.

To maintain the QUALITY of the siren when projected to the speaker. Now that I've bought the 16g... I will extend 4 cables (2 Cables connecting the Speaker and the 2 cables connecting to the power source). I hope quality does not weaken.

And, note to moderator, the correct phrase should read "for all intents and purposes".

IMO, 18 g is sufficient speaker wire from an underdash or console- mounted siren to the speaker(s), such as a PA 300, but let us realize for a trunk-mounted siren (like an 80K) where the distance to the front-mounted speakers increases, we would prefer 16 gauge wire.


Also, the original message might be taken to imply that speaker wires could be spliced - that should be a big NO, don't do it. The wiring should only be completed with one set of crip connectors, connecting the speaker wires to the wiring harness of the siren, and then the length of wiring directly to the lugs at the speaker terminals.

The speaker has already been mounted under the hood. The siren is also mounted inside the vehicle under the computer stand. I am trying to reach 4 wires together. I bought this 16 g 12 feet long wire and I am planing on connecting them together. I have tried extending the wires with a crocodile wires extension, but the quality of the siren was sleeping.

Maybe I am missing something but I thought there is the same amount of voltage drop in a run of wire no matter if it is AC or DC. What is different in sirens is the output of the final amp is approx. 33-34 volts RMS AC. Because of the higher voltage you can use a smaller conductor for the equivalent power. I personally would use 18 gauge wire for all 100 watt sirens (33 volts at 3 amps) and all 3 wire 200 watt sirens but would use 16 gauge on a 200 watt 2 wire siren (33 volts at 6 amps) if the run was over 15 feet.

Do you mean to say that, I should buy the 18g? :bonk:

 

[Henry455]

18 gauge for the speakers would have been more than adequate since you are only running 12 feet. 16 gauge (larger wire) is fine for the speaker wires since you have that BUT 16 gauge, IMHO, for the siren amp (100 watt) is marginal, almost a full volt drop in a 12 foot run and totally inadequate for a 200 watt siren. If it were my vehicle I would run a 14 gauge wire for the siren amp power OR find a power tap under the dash to keep the power run shorter and use the 16 gauge wire. On more thing, if you are running the wires in the engine compartment, make sure it is rated for under hood use (temp and fluid resistance).

 

[EVModules]

18g folks.


If you truly want the entire loop to be no less than 16g, you'd have to have a very large driver! Open it up and you'll find the coil winding of anywhere from 28g and smaller at approximately 120 feet, much longer than the normal run of hookup wire from the amplifier to the speaker.


Industry standards mandates that the maximum wire length for a two conductor copper wire for 4 ohms load using 18g is 16 feet maximum. 8 ohm is 32 feet. Siren speakers are 11 ohms so the speaker length can easily go up to 45 feet. The difference between 18g vs 16g is only .09 decibels. 18g vs 14g is .15 decibels. Keep in mind that one can start to notice the difference at 1 decibel or more.


Henry455,


I'd keep the 14g for mounting the amplifier on the back door of a double length 45ft foot trailer with the speaker in the grill of the semi.

 

[PTech]

Okay, I've bought the 18g wire from my local store. I am going to connect everything when I get back from work, however, using this 18g wire gives me reasonable doubts about few things. The quality of the siren and speaker will remain the same? Is it possible that the wire burns and break my car?


Thanks for everyone's support!

 

[Henry455]

Ptech, the 18 gauge wire is fine for the speaker wire but I would use at least 16 gauge but preferably 14 gauge wire for the power to the siren amp.


Sean, we are mostly in agreement on the advice to the O.P. I stated that 18 gauge speaker wire is more than adequate for the wire length the O.P. is contemplating but I would still use 16 gauge on a 200 watt 2 wire siren amp with runs longer than 15 feet. 2 siren speakers connected in parallel have a nominal 5.5 ohm impedance but depending on the frequency and speaker housing design, that 5.5 ohms may drop to a lower value. Is it overkill, maybe, but I look at worst case.


In regards to the 14 gauge wire, the O.P. said he bought 16 gauge wire for both the speaker and the siren amp. On a run of 12 feet and a 10 amp power draw, I would personally use 14 gauge, 16 would probably work fine but as I said before I tend to err toward overkill. I have enclosed Whelen's recommended wire size chart for a 10 amp siren and you can see they recommend 14 gauge for 13 foot runs.





I not sure of what the relevance is of the 45 foot trailer example.

 

[EVModules]

Henry455,


You're comparing apples to oranges (12.8vdc with 33 to 64vac) by using the wrong wiring chart.


Look here:


Speaker Wire


the 45 foot trailer reference (actually two as I mentioned) is explained with the wire chart.

 

[Henry455]

According to your speaker wire chart, 16 feet of 18 AWG is the MAX into a 4 ohm load. That's why I would use 16 AWG on a 5.5 Nominal impedance load on runs over 15 feet. By the way, Whelen uses 16 gauge speaker wiring on their 200 watt 295SL100 siren amp. as shown here.

 

[SlickTop Solutions]

According to your speaker wire chart, 16 feet of 18 AWG is the MAX into a 4 ohm load. That's why I would use 16 AWG on a 5.5 Nominal impedance load on runs over 15 feet. By the way, Whelen uses 16 gauge speaker wiring on their 200 watt 295SL100 siren amp. as shown here.

Um, I have to ask why when Max distance for 18 AWG at 6 ohm (.5 ohm more than 5.5 ohm) is 24 ft? So for every .5 ohm of IMPEDANCE added to a circuit, you can extend it by 2 ft using 18 AWG wire. An 8 ohm load is max of 32 ft using 18 AWG and a standard 11 ohm speaker could be a maximum of 44 ft. (more than enough for any vehicle.


This is IMPEDANCE we are dealing with, NOT RESISTANCE.


Not yelling, just capitalizing for emphasis.

 

[SlickTop Solutions]

Henry455,

You're comparing apples to oranges (12.8vdc with 33 to 64vac) by using the wrong wiring chart.


Look here:


Speaker Wire


the 45 foot trailer reference (actually two as I mentioned) is explained with the wire chart.

Sean,


He is comparing apples to oranges, but I think he is thinking resistance and not impedance, which really gets messed up when you compare AC to DC.

 

[EVModules]

Dan,


Yes, sometimes it's difficult to keep them on the same topic.


Henry, what speakers are you using? More importantly, what ohms are the speakers? In this industry, it's 11 ohms, which makes a big difference.