Cop fired after helping fellow officers in distress

[Fluffy126577]

And discuss...


From Yahoo News;


Cop fired after helping fellow officers in distress | The Lookout - Yahoo! News

 

[ParkPiggy]

Gotta love right to work states!

 

[SSgt Elmer]

Parkpiggy, it's not about that at all.


The guy didn't tell dispatch where he was going and went into a situation with an armed subject. My Sergeant wouldn't give me a chance to get fired, he'd kick my ass for doing the exact same thing. I can promise you that my unionized department in a non right to work state would fire a deputy for doing that itself.


But bias does wonderful things, doesn't it? :duh:

 

[patrol530]

Obviously he thought it was an issue, or he would of notified his dispatch. It doesn't take that long to key a mic.

 

[crescentstar69]

How far away was he from the shooting is what I would want to know. If it was around the corner, fine, but notify dispatch. If it was far away, they probably didn't need him, as many city units would beat him there.


He probably had good intentions, but was also probably call poaching. Firing offense? Probably not.

 

[K9Vic]

How far away was he from the shooting is what I would want to know. If it was around the corner, fine, but notify dispatch. If it was far away, they probably didn't need him, as many city units would beat him there.

He probably had good intentions, but was also probably call poaching. Firing offense? Probably not.

Did you even watch and LISTEN to the video? Report was he was 2mins away and has unit was also used as cover for responding HPD units.

 

[cory y]

The article says that other city units arrived behind him so I'm guessing he was pretty damn close.


He shoulda notified dispatch yes.


Should he have been fired? No. Reprimanded, yes


However I have a feeling that this officer won't be unemployed for long. When the state LEO association is behind this officer along with HPD, I tend to side with the officer.


Edit:


Rice is about 2 miles from the Greyhound station. That's a 2 minute response. Straight shot, no turns. Perfectly accecptable responce in my opinion. There was also 2 other officers on duty on campus.


If I was an officer and was shot, along with my partner by a suspect who has also assaulted other civilians... id want ever I can get. 2 miles is nothing.

 

[RL1]

Maybe he didn't tell his dispatch because they kept talking, or he may have been on HPD's channel. And before someone says 'there were only three officers working, he could have called in', I worked on a 3 man shift for 2 years and there were several times I couldn't even say 10-23 because people wouldn't shut up

 

[backdraft51]

Personally I don't see any reason to fire him. when we had one of our county officers went down every officer and deputy in the county took off to help him. So in that situation i don't see why they would fire him. But its difference in opinions. An officer is an officer to me. Campus police or not.

 

[Fluffy126577]

If it's the correct Greyhound bus station I found it's 2.34 miles down the road from Rice. But that's also depending on where he was on campus. So around 10 minutes drive time down Main Street.

 

[Henry455]

Its approx 40 city blocks, straight shot down Main st, Rice Campus is at Sunset and Main, Greyhound Terminal at Webster and Main.

 

[cory y]

If it's the correct Greyhound bus station I found it's 2.34 miles down the road from Rice. But that's also depending on where he was on campus. So around 10 minutes drive time down Main Street.

10 minutes to cover 2 miles.


Yeah I don't think so. Remember running code3 at easily 60 plus mph


I don't know if you had ever responded to an officer assist but I ain't stopping at reds, going the speed limit or any of the at bullshit.

 

[crescentstar69]

Did you even watch and LISTEN to the video? Report was he was 2mins away and has unit was also used as cover for responding HPD units.

Nope. Sure didn't. I read the article, which didn't mention his response time. Guess you're a lot more clever than I am.

 

[Fluffy126577]

10 minutes to cover 2 miles.

Yeah I don't think so. Remember running code3 at easily 60 plus mph


I don't know if you had ever responded to an officer assist but I ain't stopping at reds, going the speed limit or any of the at bullshit.

Nope. Can't say I have responded as an officer to an officer assist; but I would feel sorry for the person you hit who has the green light and the department who you would have been with who now has a lawsuit of some sort because your gonna go cowboy and run red lights and not drive with due regard.


Arrive alive... And do no harm.

 

[chono]

Nope. Can't say I have responded as an officer to an officer assist; but I would feel sorry for the person you hit who has the green light and the department who you would have been with who now has a lawsuit of some sort because your gonna go cowboy and run red lights and not drive with due regard.

Arrive alive... And do no harm.

I also have no clue but I think all training would just fly out the window on a call like this.

 

[Fluffy126577]

It's hard to say chono. I don't envy anyone who would have to go through this. I know as a dispatcher and an EMT AND volunteer firefighter working closely with officers and other public safety personnel on a daily basis regardless if I was an officer or not would have an adverse reaction to this type of call. As far as being on topic, I can see why he would rush off and want to help. But as one of my favorite sayings go; "You may know where you are... God may know where you are... But if your dispatcher doesn't know where you are... You and God better be on good terms."


Do I think this officer deserved to be fired; No. Do I think he should have been reprimanded; Yes. But going through and letting all your training and everything you have learned to go and help that fellow officer down, that baby that's not breathing, coming up to an accident scene and having to take care of a family member or dear friend not only significantly puts your own life on the line but also the other lives of people your trying to protect... trying to get there or to help that person. You do no one any good if you yourself become the next patient.

 

[cory y]

Do I think this officer deserved to be fired; No. Do I think he should have been reprimanded; Yes. But going through and letting all your training and everything you have learned to go and help that fellow officer down, that baby that's not breathing, coming up to an accident scene and having to take care of a family member or dear friend not only significantly puts your own life on the line but also the other lives of people your trying to protect... trying to get there or to help that person. You do no one any good if you yourself become the next patient.

Thats the difference between the mentality of PD and EMS. In PD, youre gonna put your life on the line to save somebody. but EMS is gonna wait and go there after its safe.

 

[crescentstar69]

The officers I have known who have worked on college campuses have never had anything good to say about their experiences. They felt they were viewed as a "necessary evil".


One local campus required a supervisor to approve any arrest of a student, regardless of what it was for. The students abused the officers knowing this. Approval was rarely granted, especially if athletes were involved. Can't arrest the thug on a scholarship who happens to be the star player. Plus, they didn't want to lose mummy and daddy's $25k a year tuition.


Another campus had a civilian "public safety director" instead of a chief, who was blatantly anti- law enforcement. The troops I knew got out of those environments pretty quickly and went to better departments.


Hopefully, this guy gets an offer from a better department. He made mistakes, but shouldn't have been thrown under the bus.

 

[dustymedic]

Thats the difference between the mentality of PD and EMS. In PD, youre gonna put your life on the line to save somebody. but EMS is gonna wait and go there after its safe.

EMS providers are generally not armed and you need to be alive to safe someone else's live...

 

[Hoser]

I would tend to side with the officer exspecially knowing how the Press can tell their own story.....

 

[RolnCode3]

This is stupid all the way around. He shouldn't be fired, reprimanded, or even looked at funny by the University. To say that the safety could be jeopardized because only two officers were there, when you have a situation where people are in the process of dying, is dumb. Why weren't the other two officers going as well? The University should be embarrassed.


I have been to MANY multi-agency calls where you're listening to an outside agency's radio go to shit (often on your mobile radio). If you go to call your own agency, you may miss important radio traffic on the emergency channel. There were numerous times where I thought it far more important to hear all of the *emergency* traffic rather than make sure my supervisor knew where I was.


Once he got there and the scene was stabilized (by whatever means) he should notify his supervisor. If he at least checked in with the other agency's dispatch at some point, I would call it good.


One officer involved shooting I went to - we covered 5 miles or so in less then 5 minutes on city streets. You can arrive safely while still responding very fast - it just takes a lot of diligence.

 

[Ben E.]

but was also probably call poaching. Firing offense? Probably not.

There is no such thing as "call poaching" on an officer down call.

 

[Station 3]

There is no such thing as "call poaching" on an officer down call.

Agreed i would of done the same thing that officer that got fired will be employed by the end of the week.

 

[WAPublicSafety]

HPD should hire him, that's ridiculous.

 

[patrol530]

Meh, hire someone who can't follow simple policy? No thanks.


Additionally, unless his jacket needed a cart to haul around, a reprimand would of sufficed.

 

[crescentstar69]

There is no such thing as "call poaching" on an officer down call.

I've BEEN the officer down, in fact I retired from the injuries, BUT........ I wouldn't have wanted a guy running like a maniac from 20 miles away when help was closer. My original post posed the question, "How far away was he?"


You took the above line out of context here. If he WAS close, he obviously wasn't poaching. If he ran hot for 20 miles after half the city was already there, he WAS poaching.


Below is the part you left out:


"How far away was he from the shooting is what I would want to know. If it was around the corner, fine, but notify dispatch. If it was far away, they probably didn't need him, as many city units would beat him there."


I also commented that he didn't deserve what he got. I still think he had a reprimand coming for not calling in his response. A campus with 3 officers on per shift can't possibly have so much radio traffic that he can't call in his response.

 

[PJD642]

A campus with 3 officers on per shift can't possibly have so much radio traffic that he can't call in his response.

I'll argue that one with you all day. We all know someone who can't just STFU on the radio and has to tell their whole life story on a vehicle lockout disposition. I've been trying to call dispatch when it's just me and 3 other cars, and haven't been able to get on the air for over 30 seconds. And trunked radios are even worse, since you're blocked and have no hope of overriding the other guy even if you're closer to the repeater. (Don't know what kind of radios they have, just sayin').


I can guarantee you the college cops get no backing from their admin and one of the ivory tower folks shit a brick thinking how the ENTIRE COLLEGE could have been sued if their cop had shot the bad guy, hence the knee jerk reaction of firing the guy.


Once the fired cop gets a police job outside academia, he'll realize how much better off he is. I worked part time for Cleveland State for a few years while full time at the Housing Authority PD in Cleveland, and as much as the HA was wishywashy about backing us, the university was a BILLION times worse.

 

[emtanderson51]

10 minutes to cover 2 miles.

Yeah I don't think so. Remember running code3 at easily 60 plus mph


I don't know if you had ever responded to an officer assist but I ain't stopping at reds, going the speed limit or any of the at bullshit.

I'm not a cop but on over 300 responses in my career ranging from fall down and go boom to the 3 y/o who slid under his dads rider mower and lost 1 1/2 legs...never ran a red. If I hit someone in an intersection or wherever....what was the use in even going to the call?? Plus I wouldn't do well in prison....

 

[FireEMSPolice]

I'll argue that one with you all day. We all know someone who can't just STFU on the radio and has to tell their whole life story on a vehicle lockout disposition. I've been trying to call dispatch when it's just me and 3 other cars, and haven't been able to get on the air for over 30 seconds. And trunked radios are even worse, since you're blocked and have no hope of overriding the other guy even if you're closer to the repeater. (Don't know what kind of radios they have, just sayin').

I can guarantee you the college cops get no backing from their admin and one of the ivory tower folks shit a brick thinking how the ENTIRE COLLEGE could have been sued if their cop had shot the bad guy, hence the knee jerk reaction of firing the guy.


Once the fired cop gets a police job outside academia, he'll realize how much better off he is. I worked part time for Cleveland State for a few years while full time at the Housing Authority PD in Cleveland, and as much as the HA was wishywashy about backing us, the university was a BILLION times worse.

You mentioned Cleveland State. Isnt that the police department thats unarmed? I know there is one college PD in Ohio where the college refuses to arm the cops.

 

[PJD642]

You mentioned Cleveland State. Isnt that the police department thats unarmed? I know there is one college PD in Ohio where the college refuses to arm the cops.

No - at the time I was there (approx 1996 to 2001?), the CSUPD full timers were issued DAO Beretta 9mms. Us part time guys carried whatever we used at our full time department. Tri-C (Cuyahoga Community College) PD guys are all armed too (Glock or Beretta 9mm), and even have a patrol/bomb certified K-9.


Columbus State (Ohio, not Georgia) doesn't carry on duty last I knew - I googled 'em and found some chat about it, but can't find their website. I interviewed a LONG time ago for the state Mental Health PD, and found out they don't carry either. Either Case Western or Notre Dame college or one of those smaller schools in the area has sworn campus police that don't carry either.


Regardless, it seems dumb to wear a uniform identifying yourself as a cop and not be able to defend yourself or someone else.

 

[FireEMSPolice]

No - at the time I was there (approx 1996 to 2001?), the CSUPD full timers were issued DAO Beretta 9mms. Us part time guys carried whatever we used at our full time department. Tri-C (Cuyahoga Community College) PD guys are all armed too (Glock or Beretta 9mm), and even have a patrol/bomb certified K-9.

Columbus State (Ohio, not Georgia) doesn't carry on duty last I knew - I googled 'em and found some chat about it, but can't find their website. I interviewed a LONG time ago for the state Mental Health PD, and found out they don't carry either. Either Case Western or Notre Dame college or one of those smaller schools in the area has sworn campus police that don't carry either.


Regardless, it seems dumb to wear a uniform identifying yourself as a cop and not be able to defend yourself or someone else.

I can understand why Mental Health PD doesnt carry, because of the people they watch over.


As far putting on a uniform with a badge, this is why I dont believe in unarmed security officers either. Just doesnt make sense.

 

[11b101abn]

I also have no clue but I think all training would just fly out the window on a call like this.

I hope not.


On calls like this, I am really tuned in, and my training is almost like a default setting.


In this profession, casualties are hard to swallow,but acceptable, just not civilian casualites.

 

[Trisdisp57]

Last year there was a 10-1 in my fire district, officer down. It was a plain clothes gang unit cop and his partner. They got jumped by 30 gang members in a not so safe part of the neighborhood, the first 10-1 in 10 years. when they transmitted that they automatically activated the rescue squad on a standby. I was on the bus and we drove in and parked around the corner, my partner was an ex cop he wanted to get out and help. When we got down the road We saw 16 different cruisers


parked all over the area and mobile patrols looking for the perps that ran off. they were from multiple different LE agancies, State PD, Parks Police, County PD, the next county over PD, Sherriffs deputy, Public safety(unarmed town ordinance police),


Park Rangers, and a few vollies that were in the area heard it on the scanner at home and ran over 2 blocks to help. Im sorry if an officer needs assistance come one come all and help.

 

[Ipuvaepe]

I know my first post being in a two-week old thread (though I wouldn't have posted if the previous post wasn't almost two weeks before its previous) disagreeing with the general flow of the conversation isn't good for my life expectancy here on eLightbars, but here goes.


The article only mentions the man having a gun. Not pulling it, not aiming it, not even having it OC. Now of course it does say that the man shot the off-duty cop, but it doesn't say the circumstances that lead up to it. Now I know many members of this forum are officers of the law, but my experience with police officers while carrying has been completely and wholly negative. It would be my experience that the initial confrontation was not as it seems, and I can guarantee the details aren't all there, but I'm glad the officer was only wounded in the hand. Though, that really depends which hand and which part, gunshot to the hand is rather complex rehabilitation.


But then again, I don't live in Texas.


Also, early May is a pretty hot (metaphorically and actually) time on Texas campuses, but I do agree, he shouldn't have been canned.

 

[VolEms]

Crazy! I don't think the campus was in danger with one less cop. If u hear a 10-13 u go and ask questions later. This officer is a hero and should get an award for it. He is a true good cop. It seems he was very close and first o/s. I hope the boss that fired him gets disiplined.

 

[FireGuru]

Been there, done this ... in the small county that I served as a special commissioned Deputy Sheriff. In Morrow County Ohio on oposite end of county ... Ohio State Patrol officer in distress .... your whole dimension of your training changes ... everything you have learned comes to full gear!! All your senses are at max, and it is amazing what you will find out your cruiser is capable of doing!! My partner and I covered 25 miles in 14 minutes, was 2nd officers to arrive to assist and about 15 more about 3 minutes behind us ... and they were still coming.


You hear that call .... and it is a "ya'll come" call!!


I know if I am screaming that on the radio.. I would expect nothing less!! PERIOD!! And for an agency to dismiss an officer doing the courtesy that they themselves would expect from a neighboring agency ... I agree with the others on here... should be ashamed!!


I wouldn't care if it was ACME Cartoon Security Services showing up to help me out!! I want someone .. and I want them NOW!!


It's a brotherhood ... they don't call it a thin blue line for nothing!! Same goes for the thin red line.


.... getting me on my soapbox!! Hope they get this guy back behind a badge quick!!


NEXT!!.....

 

[FireEMSPolice]

Its good he has all this outpouring of support, but what he really needs is an LEO job. Why hasnt one been offered to him?