Does this kind of thing happen often?

[Clarence H]

Story about license plate checks


Ex-St. Paul police officer says other cops infringed on her private data, with little fear of discipline - TwinCities.com


Clarence

 

[mcpd2025]

I would hope not. Its a violation of NCIC to run people for other than a legitimate reason. If she is driving in front of me, I have a legit reason to run her tag. If my partner tells me she is hot, thats not a legit reason to run her tag so I can see her license photo. On the rare occasion I pull over a smoking hot female though, I may ask my buddy to come by the stop and be a cover officer though... But you know, thats only to protect me from potential false allegations of any misconduct that may arise...

 

[BackYardSales]

If she is driving in front of me, I have a legit reason to run her tag.

Well, maybe, maybe not. If the plate is current and the driver is not committing any sort of violation, then no. If there's a question on validity of the plate or a recent BOLO for a vehicle of the same description, then yes. I don't agree with running plates of every vehicle an officer gets behind (like some do) on the off chance they might get a hit. Yes, of course there is a chance that 'hot chick' could have a warrant for a parking ticket but I still don't like random checks or automated plate scanners.


Yes, misuse is a violation of the User Agreement and not only can the officer get in trouble, but the agency can lose terminal access in cases of gross violations. Despite that, I've seen people post plates here (or pictures of plates) 'in case anybody wants to run it'.

 

[WhiteLite03]

Story about license plate checks


Ex-St. Paul police officer says other cops infringed on her private data, with little fear of discipline - TwinCities.com


Clarence

The answer would be yes, much more often than anyone would think. Especially with the widespread use of mobile data terminals, looking up information is fast and easy, and doesn't require dispatch to check each tag or license anymore over the radio. Like the article says, it's not something that is brought up often, but it happens. Access to that sort of information in LE jobs (civilian or sworn) is a keyboard and a mouse away; it's all logged and audited, but if nothing rings any bells most of it won't be looked into. There are who knows how many thousands or tens of thousands of records legitimately run every day in each state (well, most states anyway,) kinda hard for the state to pick out the curiosity queries.


I expect to get some feedback from this post, but I can't imagine that anyone would have a legitimate argument that it never happens at their agency. I know it happened at both of the ones I worked at. :eyebrowhuh:

 

[PJD642]

Well, maybe, maybe not. If the plate is current and the driver is not committing any sort of violation, then no. If there's a question on validity of the plate or a recent BOLO for a vehicle of the same description, then yes. (snip)

6th Circuit Court of Appeals decision, Ellison v. United States - "a motorist has no reasonable expectation of privacy in the information contained on his license plate under the Fourth Amendment", and "so long as the officer had a right to be in a position to observe the defendant’s license plate, any such observation and corresponding use of the information on the plate does not violate the Fourth Amendment." They also emphasized that there is no expectation of privacy for a license plate or VIN that is required to be displayed on the outside of the vehicle, and an electronic or physical retrieval of records associated with that license plate or VIN does not constitute a "search" under the 4th amendment. So there does not need to be any observed violation or other "trigger" before a check of the plate is conducted.


Having said the above, I'm NOT saying what the OP cited was ok - that was a clear violation of terms & conditions, and is grounds for discipline. What I'm saying is I don't need a reason to run random plates I see during the course of my shift, but you're still gonna have some explaining to do if all your "random" vehicle checks are height/weight proportionate females with blonde hair between 18 & 29 years old.

 

[BigWil]

Well, maybe, maybe not. If the plate is current and the driver is not committing any sort of violation, then no. If there's a question on validity of the plate or a recent BOLO for a vehicle of the same description, then yes. I don't agree with running plates of every vehicle an officer gets behind (like some do) on the off chance they might get a hit. Yes, of course there is a chance that 'hot chick' could have a warrant for a parking ticket but I still don't like random checks or automated plate scanners.


Yes, misuse is a violation of the User Agreement and not only can the officer get in trouble, but the agency can lose terminal access in cases of gross violations. Despite that, I've seen people post plates here (or pictures of plates) 'in case anybody wants to run it'.

And how do I know the plate is current? We use stickers here, and people are known to steal them or make their own. I have the right, while on duty, to run any plate I want of any vehicle I see.

 

[calebsheltonmed23]

6th Circuit Court of Appeals decision, Ellison v. United States - "a motorist has no reasonable expectation of privacy in the information contained on his license plate under the Fourth Amendment", and "so long as the officer had a right to be in a position to observe the defendant’s license plate, any such observation and corresponding use of the information on the plate does not violate the Fourth Amendment." They also emphasized that there is no expectation of privacy for a license plate or VIN that is required to be displayed on the outside of the vehicle, and an electronic or physical retrieval of records associated with that license plate or VIN does not constitute a "search" under the 4th amendment. So there does not need to be any observed violation or other "trigger" before a check of the plate is conducted.

Having said the above, I'm NOT saying what the OP cited was ok - that was a clear violation of terms & conditions, and is grounds for discipline. What I'm saying is I don't need a reason to run random plates I see during the course of my shift, but you're still gonna have some explaining to do if all your "random" vehicle checks are height/weight proportionate females with blonde hair between 18 & 29 years old.

I'm not sure about other states, but even a civi can run a VIN through dispatch. All that can be told is if it's stolen or not. Just like a gun. LP's are govt. property. Govt. has the right to run their own shit. And for christ's sake, if you have done nothing wrong and have no wants or warrants, then there is no reason anyone should be mad about a plate being ran. It get's warrants and stolen property more than anyone would think in the civi world. Actual driver queries on the other hand, is a different story. They aren't just laying around. But plates are fair game. Don't want them ran, don't drive a vehicle, period.

 

[Phillyrube]

I call it "Red Light Lotto". Stop at a light and run everything in view. In Virginia, a citizen can go to the DMV and ask if his plate has been run. If so, he can FOIA the info gained from the inquiry. But, like PJD642 said, case law allows you to run it, no expectation of privacy while out in public.

 

[mcpd2025]

Well, maybe, maybe not. If the plate is current and the driver is not committing any sort of violation, then no. If there's a question on validity of the plate or a recent BOLO for a vehicle of the same description, then yes. I don't agree with running plates of every vehicle an officer gets behind (like some do) on the off chance they might get a hit. Yes, of course there is a chance that 'hot chick' could have a warrant for a parking ticket but I still don't like random checks or automated plate scanners.

Imagine that... you don't like how police operate... who would have guessed. Like others have stated, I can run ANY tag of ANY vehicle that is in my jurisdiction for ANY reason, so long as I am legally in a place to see the tag. Its called good police work, something you obviously frown upon. Its awful hard for me to look at a vehicle and know if the registered owner has a warrant, something that can be found by running the tag. Its hard for me to look at a vehicle and know if the tags were suspended for vehicle emissions or insurance violation. Its hard for me to know or remember every single vehicle that is stolen in the Washington DC area every day. Not sure where you are from, but the port of Baltimore is a huge export location for stolen cars to west Africa. People will steal any type of car, not just Camry's, Accords or Caravan's, and ship it out of the country to sell for a profit. Thus vehicles drive in and around my jurisdiction every day.


I don't really care if you like random checks or license readers... they are legal and effective. If you wish to opt out of that system, sell your car (probably mommy's car anyway...) and turn in your license. Until then, you are bound to the regulations imposed by the state on your PRIVILEGE to drive. I had a conversation with my rookie last night that he should be running tags at every red light. That information is a public record, thus you have no expectation of privacy in reference to that information.


Know what you are talking about or keep it to yourself dude. Its better that people think you are a dunce rather than open your mouth (or start typing) and proving that you are a dunce...


Don't you have some internet searches for police officer misconduct that you should be doing right now?

 

[mcpd2025]

Having said the above, I'm NOT saying what the OP cited was ok - that was a clear violation of terms & conditions, and is grounds for discipline. What I'm saying is I don't need a reason to run random plates I see during the course of my shift, but you're still gonna have some explaining to do if all your "random" vehicle checks are height/weight proportionate females with blonde hair between 18 & 29 years old.

Very well said. My job is worth more to me than being a creep and semi-stalking some chick...

 

[calebsheltonmed23]

I call it "Red Light Lotto". Stop at a light and run everything in view. In Virginia, a citizen can go to the DMV and ask if his plate has been run. If so, he can FOIA the info gained from the inquiry. But, like PJD642 said, case law allows you to run it, no expectation of privacy while out in public.

Good idea!! Wish we had more traffic lights where I'm at! Only 1 in our counties jurisdiction. One town has a few, but their PD covers that.

 

[Phillyrube]

Good idea!! Wish we had more traffic lights where I'm at! Only 1 in our counties jurisdiction. One town has a few, but their PD covers that.

One of my guys ran a plate on a guy last night, suspended OL, lots of drug arrests. Pulls his photo, and he's driving. Pulls him over......sees a large amount of cash in plain view. Freezes the scene, calls the drug dog....dog starts humping the rear tire badly. Search finds almost 11K in cash, cocaine powdered scales, baggies, etc. Very nice bust!

 

[mcpd2025]

One of my guys ran a plate on a guy last night, suspended OL, lots of drug arrests. Pulls his photo, and he's driving. Pulls him over......sees a large amount of cash in plain view. Freezes the scene, calls the drug dog....dog starts humping the rear tire badly. Search finds almost 11K in cash, cocaine powdered scales, baggies, etc. Very nice bust!

But BackDoorSales doesn't think officers should do this, because he thinks its illegal. If you give him enough time, he'll do a Google search and find a single instance of an officer allegedly doing something wrong after make a stop based upon tag info...

 

[Luismariadarlene]

wow thats crazy that many searches for this one chick no girl is worth losing your job for

 

[EVT]

Yep, MN DVS is pretty sweet and has nice photos. When I was younger I watched officers many times pull it up for complete BS reasons. One guy had a buddy who would call from the bar and have him run chicks to make sure they were clean/hot. This was only 4-5 years ago.

I would hope not. Its a violation of NCIC to run people for other than a legitimate reason. If she is driving in front of me, I have a legit reason to run her tag. If my partner tells me she is hot, thats not a legit reason to run her tag so I can see her license photo. On the rare occasion I pull over a smoking hot female though, I may ask my buddy to come by the stop and be a cover officer though... But you know, thats only to protect me from potential false allegations of any misconduct that may arise...

It's not tied into NCIC, it's Minnesota's internal DVS system....

 

[FireEMSPolice]

Cant believe nobody asked this, but we need a pic of the officer to see if it was worth getting anything negative in your file or ruining your career

 

[Core Public Safety]

I'll confess that I didn't read the article. Does it make mention of why she is an ex-officer?

 

[Donslock]

I don't remember seeing it in there other than she went to another deptartment. Don Myhre

 

[Jarred J.]

I'll confess that I didn't read the article. Does it make mention of why she is an ex-officer?

early medical retirement

 

[Ipuvaepe]

Got a bit of a chuckle out of the entire thread, oh how I love photo exempt licenses.

 

[mcpd2025]

It's not tied into NCIC, it's Minnesota's internal DVS system....

Gotcha, on our MDT's we tie into the Motor Vehicle Administration via NCIC. Regardless, on a MDT or a desktop computer, we are still held to the MVA standards by which we can run tags.

 

[Core Public Safety]

early medical retirement

Interesting... considering this

After she retired from St. Paul, she entered fitness competitions for a short time.

 

[patrol530]

Must of been more mental and less physical.

 

[Clarence H]

Here is a more in depth story:


Is Anne Marie Rasmusson too hot to have a driver's license? - Page 1 - News - Minneapolis - City Pages