FF Shot in Bellmore, NY

ffjwhite

Member
May 21, 2010
1,082
Bombay, NY
I just saw a page on IPN about a FF getting shot in Bellmore, NY. So I went online to see if I could find the news story and there is one. I hope the FF makes a Speedy and full recovery.


http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local/First-Responder-Shot-While-Responding-to-Accident-in-Bellmore-117214933.html

A first responder was shot while responding to an accident on Long Island’s South Shore, according to law enforcement sources.

Members of the Bellmore Fire Department and Nassau Police responded to Bellmore Avenue and Claxton Avenue in Bellmore, NY, to a report of a car accident.


Once they arrived at the accident scene, the driver who crashed the car into a light pole, began to shoot at first responders, sources told NBCNewYork.com.


Nassau Police shot at the driver and struck him at least once, according to sources. As many as ten shots may have been fired during this incident. A first responder was shot and two officers may have suffered injuries unrelated to the shooting.


All injured parties were brought to Nassau University Medical Center for treatment.


Check back with NBCNewYork.com for new developments on this developing story.
 

Amanda

Member
May 24, 2010
193
NY, USA
From 1RWN:


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *CAR VS POLE* BELLMORE AVE X MERRICK RD. CAR VS POLE W/ TRANSFORMER DOWN. PD REQ F/W FOR SHOTS FIRED AT SCN. NY87


03/01/11 10:01 PM


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *SHOOTING* MERRICK RD I/V/O CLAXTON. 20 Y/O/ MALE SHOT. 6011 TX TO MEDICAL CTR. ALL FD UNITS OFF SCN . UNITS V. NY87


03/01/11 10:05 PM


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *FD ASSIST* BELLMORE AVE C/S CLAXTON AVE. BFD AMB-6011 W/ AN URGENT MSG, BEING SHOT AT WHILE OP @ SCN OF MVA, PD REQ F/W. NY96


03/01/11 10:06 PM


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *PD-INV SHOOTING* BELLMORE & CLAXON. SGT 743 RPT SUBJ FIRING @ PD, PD SHOT PERP & IS STILL IN AUTO. ESU, K9, BSO, AVN O/S NY69


03/01/11 10:09 PM


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *OFFICER ASSIST* BELLMORE & CLAXON. RMP 708 O/S RPT SUBJ FIRING @ PD & FD. REQ ASSISTANCE F/W. AVN, K-9, BSO, ESU O/S. NY69


03/01/11 10:11 PM


BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *INJ FF* BELLMORE & CLAXON. BFD AMB6011 TX 1 FD MOS TO NUMC W/ GSW TO BACK NY69


03/01/11 10:13 PM *APPROVAL: 1RWN2*


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *CAR VS POLE* BELLMORE AVE X CLAXTON. ALL BELLMORE FD UNITS STAGING AT STATION 2-SCENE UNSECURE DUE TO SHOOTING. NY87


03/01/11 10:13 PM


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *PD-INV SHOOTING* BELLMORE & CLAXON. ESU RPT SCN IS SAFE, SUBJ NO LONGER ARMED. REQ AMB TO RESP IN FOR GSW TO PERP NY87*NY69


03/01/11 10:15 PM


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *OFFICER ASSIST* BELLMORE & CLAXON. ESU RPT SCN SECURE, AMB E/R TO PERP W/ GSW NY69


03/01/11 10:17 PM


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *FD ASSIST* BELLMORE AVE C/S CLAXTON AVE. BFD M.O.S. SHOT BY PERP, NOW PD-INV SHOOTING, SUBJ IN CAR. NY69*NY87*NY96


03/01/11 10:20 PM


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *INJ OFFICER* BELLMORE AVE & CLAXTON AVE. NCPD SGT 743 RPT 3 INJ MOS TX TO NR HOSP. NY87


03/01/11 10:28 PM *APPROVAL: 1RWN2*


FINAL U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *FD ASSIST* AMB-6011 TX 20 Y/O M.O.S. TO N.U.M.C. W/ GSW TO BACK, PD SECURED SCN, PERP SHOT IN HEAD, DET & SQD REQ. NY96


03/01/11 10:31 PM


FINAL U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *CAR VS POLE* BELLMORE AVE X MERRICK RD. SCN SECURE- REQ LIPA F/W FOR LIVE WIRES. NY87


03/01/11 10:33 PM


U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *PD-INV SHOOTING* BELLMORE AVE & CLAXTON AVE. PERP TX TO NUMC, REQ DET'S & SQUAD TO SCN. SHUTTING DOWN RDWY NY69


03/01/11 10:34 PM


FINAL U/D BELLMORE, NY (NASSAU) *OFFICER ASSIST* BELLMORE & CLAXTON. 3 INJ OFFICERS TX TO HOSP . SCN SECURE. DET'S & SQUAD E/R NY87*NY69


03/01/11 10:53 PM
 

C420sailor

Member
May 23, 2010
502
Virginia, USA
The perp was killed by police. Good kill.


It's stuff like this that makes me think about keeping my shotgun in my truck. I know it's a huge no-no to go on a Fire or EMS call with a firearm, but in the end it's my pink ass...
 

PC Comms

Member
May 30, 2010
1,881
Beautiful southern Georgia!
C420sailor said:
The perp was killed by police. Good kill.

It's stuff like this that makes me think about keeping my shotgun in my truck. I know it's a huge no-no to go on a Fire or EMS call with a firearm, but in the end it's my pink ass...

I hate to say this, but if that's the way you feel, it's time to get out of the business. We as FFs and EMTs are not police officers. It is not our job to dispatch armed individuals. Plain and simple. One of the first things I learned when I went through my training in both fields was to treat EVERY scene as if it is a hostile one. Take nothing for granted and expect the unexpected. Shit happens and things go bad, as evidenced by this call, but to start carrying firearms on calls is going to an extreme. This is an isolated incident (I can't remember the last time I heard of an FF being shot while on a call) but if you feel that unsafe going out there, buy some body armor. It's come down considerably in price now and is very affordable. Just my $0.02
 

BigDogg795

Member
May 21, 2010
386
Long Island, NY
PC Comms said:
I hate to say this, but if that's the way you feel, it's time to get out of the business. We as FFs and EMTs are not police officers. It is not our job to dispatch armed individuals. Plain and simple. One of the first things I learned when I went through my training in both fields was to treat EVERY scene as if it is a hostile one. Take nothing for granted and expect the unexpected. Shit happens and things go bad, as evidenced by this call, but to start carrying firearms on calls is going to an extreme. This is an isolated incident (I can't remember the last time I heard of an FF being shot while on a call) but if you feel that unsafe going out there, buy some body armor. It's come down considerably in price now and is very affordable. Just my $0.02

I'm going to have to start considering picking up a new vest when I have some extra money...my current one is just too old already.

911 said:
thats my brother in laws station, bellmore engine 2

If you speak to anyone from that dept; wish them my condolences from Suffolk County, will you?
 

HalliganHook

Member
Dec 15, 2010
62
Long Island, NY
Bellmore FD Ambulance arrived on the scene of the MVA first before any NCPD units. 20 year old Bellmore FF/EMT approached the vehicle that had struck a telephone pole, the driver of the vehicle got out and started shooting at the BFD first responders, and caught the poor kid in the back. NCPD was notified by FD dispatcher of a shooting taking place, NCPD arrived and units were shot at several times (12-16 shots fired by the perp), NCPD cops fired back and tagged the asshole in the head. They searched his car after the shooting stopped and it was loaded with guns.


Thankfully, the Bellmore FD FF/EMT is in stable condition as of 0600hrs today. This could of turned into a real disaster, but I heard the chauffeur of the first FD unit on scene really controlled the scene and got the members to safety once the perp started shooting.


~Kirk
 

911

New Member
May 22, 2010
3,834
New York City
the injured FF was posting on facebook as of 6 am this morning, he said he was in icu recovering............should make a full recovery....... keep him and his family in your prayers
 

C420sailor

Member
May 23, 2010
502
Virginia, USA
PC Comms said:
I hate to say this, but if that's the way you feel, it's time to get out of the business. We as FFs and EMTs are not police officers. It is not our job to dispatch armed individuals. Plain and simple. One of the first things I learned when I went through my training in both fields was to treat EVERY scene as if it is a hostile one. Take nothing for granted and expect the unexpected. Shit happens and things go bad, as evidenced by this call, but to start carrying firearms on calls is going to an extreme. This is an isolated incident (I can't remember the last time I heard of an FF being shot while on a call) but if you feel that unsafe going out there, buy some body armor. It's come down considerably in price now and is very affordable. Just my $0.02

You're right, I'm not a police officer. I still have a right to defend myself from those who wish to do me harm.
 

Phillyrube

Member
May 21, 2010
1,272
Flatistan
C420sailor said:
You're right, I'm not a police officer. I still have a right to defend myself from those who wish to do me harm.

Thank you....spoken like a true sheepdog (for info see On Combat, by Lt. Col. Dave Grossman, in it he talks about the difference between the sheepdogs, the wolves and the sheep. There is a good article about the sheepdog concept on the website: http://www.killology.com/sheep_dog.htm )
 

ISU_Cyclone

Member
May 21, 2010
1,447
SE Wisconsin, USA
PC Comms said:
I hate to say this, but if that's the way you feel, it's time to get out of the business. We as FFs and EMTs are not police officers. It is not our job to dispatch armed individuals. Plain and simple. One of the first things I learned when I went through my training in both fields was to treat EVERY scene as if it is a hostile one. Take nothing for granted and expect the unexpected. Shit happens and things go bad, as evidenced by this call, but to start carrying firearms on calls is going to an extreme. This is an isolated incident (I can't remember the last time I heard of an FF being shot while on a call) but if you feel that unsafe going out there, buy some body armor. It's come down considerably in price now and is very affordable. Just my $0.02

It's not my job to be an unarmed victim, either. Isolated incident or not, one time is too many and shows how bad things like this can happen. If someone lawfully keeping a weapon in their vehicle is going to an extreme, then I guess a lot of people are extreme.
 

chono

Member
Jun 5, 2010
496
Midwest
Hey I am here to help. Bam. Who is that screwed up in the brain that they shoot someone trying to help them? Some people in this world just need to be taken out back and shot.


Hope the FF recovers fast!


Good job to the police for taking that POS off the face of the earth.
 

PC Comms

Member
May 30, 2010
1,881
Beautiful southern Georgia!
ISU_Cyclone said:
It's not my job to be an unarmed victim, either. Isolated incident or not, one time is too many and shows how bad things like this can happen. If someone lawfully keeping a weapon in their vehicle is going to an extreme, then I guess a lot of people are extreme.

I am not arguing over someone legally carrying a firearm in THEIR VEHICLE or on THEIR PERSON, but it should not be out on a call. It opens a whole new can of worms. I have been on firefighting sites and had this conversation before. I felt the way you guys do... until things when they were put into a different perspective. We have a certain amount of trust from the public as firefighters and medical personnel that the police do not receive and that is because they (most of the time) do not perceive us as a "threat". (I don't know if the word "threat" is appropriate, but you get the idea). They do not see us as a person with a weapon that can potentially harm them or take their liberties away, but as a live saving figure who is there to help them. The psychological aspect of seeing a public servant with a weapon as opposed to seeing one without is pretty amazing.


It is a proven fact that most people (right, wrong or otherwise) fear the police. They hear bullshit stories about the rare instance where a police officer abused their authority and they allow themselves to have this fear. Yes, it is wrong for them to feel like this, but it only takes one or two bad apples doing something stupid to make people judge an entire nation of good cops. Any officer can tell you how they are treated differently out on the street for a little while after some dumb ass fucks up somewhere. The Rodney King incident is a PERFECT example of what I am talking about. People all over this nation went CRAZY and treated the police EVERYWHERE like they personally were involved with that incident. Abner Louima in New York is another example. A couple of dumb fucks made life miserable for the entire department for almost a year after that incident. Is it fair? No, but it is a fact of life.


I know that there are going to be some on this board that are going to say "if you didn't do anything wrong, then you have nothing to fear" and while that is true, it is human instinct to fear authoritative figures. Example, people who flee while being pulled over for a simple traffic infraction. Most that flee have reason to. But there are the occasional ones that do it because something in their mind says to, (for no valid reason), and they do it, only to find out later that they are upstanding citizens with no criminal history. Not even so much as a single traffic ticket. What makes them do it? that sub conscious fear. The same applies here. When we show up at a scene, we are invited into peoples homes without pause or question because they do not perceive us as a threat. We generally are not targeted by scumbags who are out to harm an authoritative figure because of this unspoken trust. When we start displaying firearms on a scene, and using them, we will lose that trust that we have gained.


Look, I'm not saying to go out there blindly and let people do whatever they want to do to you. All I'm saying is that there are ways to protect yourself without having to be armed. Size up your scene, approach EVERY one as if shit is going to hit the fan because it can, as evidenced by this call. Finally, in some states (PA for example) it is against the law to have a weapon on you while performing your duties as a FF or an EMT. Not only can you be charged criminally, but imaging some skell who took a shot at you being able to sue you for damn near everything you own because you put a round in his ass. Just adds insult to injury. OK, I'm off of my soapbox now. awww.dhammawheel.com_images_smilies_soapbox.gif
 

ISU_Cyclone

Member
May 21, 2010
1,447
SE Wisconsin, USA
PC Comms,


The post you originally replied to stated that he was considering keeping a shotgun in his truck, and it appeared you took issue with that. If not, then I agree with you. Keeping a personal weapon in a personal vehicle is completely fine, but fire personnel shouldn't necessarily be carrying on their person.
 

PC Comms

Member
May 30, 2010
1,881
Beautiful southern Georgia!
ISU_Cyclone said:
PC Comms,

The post you originally replied to stated that he was considering keeping a shotgun in his truck, and it appeared you took issue with that. If not, then I agree with you. Keeping a personal weapon in a personal vehicle is completely fine, but fire personnel shouldn't necessarily be carrying on their person.

It wasn't so much issue with him having it in the truck, but with the premise of possibly using it while on a fire or EMS scene. We all do these jobs knowing that certain things can happen, but I was always taught to retreat to a safe distance or place, not to run back to my vehicle, get a weapon out of it and confront the attacker. If you have enough time to retreat to your vehicle, remove a weapon, shoulder it and fire, you likely have enough time to remove yourself from the scene, be it by foot or by driving away in your vehicle. Again, just my $0.02
 

Rofocowboy84

Member
May 20, 2010
1,161
Centre County, PA
PC Comms said:
I hate to say this, but if that's the way you feel, it's time to get out of the business. We as FFs and EMTs are not police officers. It is not our job to dispatch armed individuals. Plain and simple. One of the first things I learned when I went through my training in both fields was to treat EVERY scene as if it is a hostile one. Take nothing for granted and expect the unexpected. Shit happens and things go bad, as evidenced by this call, but to start carrying firearms on calls is going to an extreme. This is an isolated incident (I can't remember the last time I heard of an FF being shot while on a call) but if you feel that unsafe going out there, buy some body armor. It's come down considerably in price now and is very affordable. Just my $0.02

Ordinary civilians aren't LEO's either, so are they not supposed to be able to defend themselves?
 

C420sailor

Member
May 23, 2010
502
Virginia, USA
PC Comms said:
It wasn't so much issue with him having it in the truck, but with the premise of possibly using it while on a fire or EMS scene. We all do these jobs knowing that certain things can happen, but I was always taught to retreat to a safe distance or place, not to run back to my vehicle, get a weapon out of it and confront the attacker. If you have enough time to retreat to your vehicle, remove a weapon, shoulder it and fire, you likely have enough time to remove yourself from the scene, be it by foot or by driving away in your vehicle. Again, just my $0.02

And what about my buddies who are also on scene? I don't know about you, but I have a serious problem hopping in my truck and saying "best of luck boys!" and running away. And what happens if the attacker kills an innocent after I flee? You might be able to wring your hands of that, but I would have a VERY hard time sleeping at night.


Would I run into the house and confront the attacker? Only if I had to. Only if my buddies were still in there. Would I use the firearm as necessary to get all innocents to safety? You bet.


Google "firefighter shot". You'll be surprised at how often this happens.
 

PC Comms

Member
May 30, 2010
1,881
Beautiful southern Georgia!
Well, I guess we are going to just have to agree to disagree on this. I'm not looking to start a battle here. You have your opinion on the matter and I have mine. Sorry if my opinions upset you.
 

PJD642

New Member
May 20, 2010
1,543
east of Cleveland
I seem to recall a long thread on the old board about carrying rifles on fire trucks...believe the consensus was that it was a bad idea and would undermine the public's faith in FFs & EMTs.
 

C420sailor

Member
May 23, 2010
502
Virginia, USA
PJD642 said:
I seem to recall a long thread on the old board about carrying rifles on fire trucks...believe the consensus was that it was a bad idea and would undermine the public's faith in FFs & EMTs.

And I agree with that. A department should not furnish firearms for its members. But if a member wishes to carry a personal firearm completely concealed, or keep one in his POV for self defense...
 
Jul 14, 2010
1,639
S.W. Ohio USA
In this day and age, EMS should be wearing body armor. I can't see it being practical for responding firefighters though. (Under gear, airpacks, heat, etc.) Problem is, you never know when you will need it, so it must be worn at all times.
 

Drewstang

Member
May 25, 2010
204
Louisville, KY
crescentstar69 said:
In this day and age, EMS should be wearing body armor. I can't see it being practical for responding firefighters though. (Under gear, airpacks, heat, etc.) Problem is, you never know when you will need it, so it must be worn at all times.

My cousin started that arguement with Louisville Fire Dept 15 years ago. It still hasn't caught on....


I believe EMT's sound be equipped with armor for stabs and bullets. I also posted in the thread from the old board that I think in some situations, a weapon on the apparatus is a good thing. I have a concealed weapons permit for KY as does 4-5 other members of our station. I know when and when not to draw a weapon. I couldn't imagine working another firefighter on scene thinking, "if I had only grabbed my gun before getting on the truck........" When our safety is first, then the victims, then property I do not see why it would be a problem. The public does not need to know about it unless an incident occured, then let the PR folks explain it.
 

colby4601

Member
May 23, 2010
64
Southeastern Saskatchewan
EMT's/Medics in the Regina Qu'Appelle Health Region (RQHR) consisting of multiple EMS Companies are ALL outfitted with body armour. The same goes for the majority of other health regions in the Province. Pretty small price to pay if it saves your life. And these vests certainly have.
 

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